Brodak Guardian AF-2S

I have just purchased the Guardian carrier kit and I want to use it on a 3-wire system for speed control. I think the takeoffs with a idling engine and then rev up when I want to takeoff form a stooge makes a lot of sense for safety reasons. I have a Magnum 36A r/c engine to put on it.

I have not seen any threads on the Brodak carrier kits so I was wandering if anyone has some hints on building the kit and if there are any watch out for's.

There probably won't be much on this board for carrier kits because this is a stunt board.

I built the Guardian last year and flew it in Sportsman Carrier at the Brodak Fly In. The kit is fine and went together easily. Unless you are already an Expert, I would scrap the line slider and build it as simple as possible.

The "Watch List" item will be the fuel tank. The nose is very short, so a regular full-size stunt tank will not fit in the usual location without some major wing surgery. If you are planning to fly the model in Carrier, you will not need a whole lot of fuel - depending on your engine. The first seven laps are hot, then the bulk of your time is spent in slow flight.

You could search on this board for Dirty Dan's tips with his Flite Streak - or read the Stunt News articles. IIRC, He mounted a regular plastic tank on the inboard side of the nose and it works okay.

Have fun,

Ron King

Bill Caukins, the designer, is quite active here and a super guy....I'm certain that he can answer most questions that you might have.
It's a great kit and good flyer....

The .36 works very well in Profile, and the rules change makes it legal (it is slightly larger than .36).

See Ya

I have been flying the Gaurdian for some time now. Ditch the line slider and locate leadouts at what looks good(make adjustable leadout guide). Try one of the plastic or clunk tanks. Four ounces should be enough unless you overpower the plane. Without all the carrier stuff it should come out light. Later, DOC

PS:With the thick airfoil it should make a good stunter.

Thanks for the replies and the hints. I'll be building the Guardian during the next winter months so now I can make a few adjustments. I'll be flying the plane as a stunt model only, not carrier, but I like the speed control aspect. I like idling the plane on the stoogie before takeoffs especially when I'm flying by myself. It will be safer then having the engine reved up and then running out to grab the handle to fly the plane. I hope this speed control works for me and is not too difficult to setup. I get quite dizzy so I hope slowing down and landing will make it safer for me as well.

Marvin...
I would think that it's a pretty tall order for all but the most experienced to fly any three line model as a stunt plane....the line twisting problems are daunting, and three line handles have unequal biasing and overhang.
Using a two line set-up on a three line bellcrank is dangerous....
I would re-think this.

See Ya

Hi Peabody. I need more info on your last reply as to what is meant by "three line handles have unequal biasing and overhang.
Using a two line set-up on a three line bellcrank is dangerous...."

I will be using three 60' lines and a new Brodak three line handle. Are there tricks in having this setup that I'm over looking?
What are the dangers and what do you mean by "Using a two line set-up on a three line bellcrank is dangerous" ???
I will be doing Figure 8's, Wingovers and some loops and I understand that I will not do many Loops because of the line frictions. Do I need to install a spring on the carb arm to return it to idle, especially at the stoogie?
Marvin.

LAST EDITED ON Nov-07-04 AT 08:40 PM (CDT)
 
Hi Marvin,

A couple of the FM Skylarks members fly throttle equipped 3 - line controlled biplanes (SIG ULtimates and Brodak 38s) with considerable success & enjoyment. One member even entered his Ultimate bipe (61 powered) in open stunt at their annual contest this past summer. Although these bipes are not a P/A machine in the true sense of the word, the complete pattern was flown followed by a throttle controlled landing. These aircraft are a treat to watch perform.

Eggy,
Is there a contact man that I might "reach out and touch",..in a e-mail sense Regarding the Ultimate's set up? It looks like all the ailerons where used for control. Interested to know what linkage they used for this.,,,or is it just the lower wing flaps are controlled? Thanks.

LAST EDITED ON Nov-08-04 AT 07:11 AM (CDT)
 
Tony here's a shot showing the control set up. The owner of this aircraft is Orvin Fossen

These are well proven performers. I've watched them fly in contests for several years.

Eggy,
I've tried the e-mail twice and got failure notices both times. If you see Orvin, or have other means of contact maybe you could tell him I'm looking to chat with him. Thanks.

The main concern is these handles are not designed for stunting. They are very cumbersome, the line spacing is fixed - as is the neutral. You must make up your lines spot on.

What Rich is saying about the overhang is the cables exit the handle out in front of the centerline axis of the handle. This makes it harder for you to input the control necessary for a stunter.

I have flown the three line system for many years on my Carrier and Scale ships. You can do the rudimentary stunts (loops, lazy eights, wingovers, etc.), but you have to really be careful and practise a lot.

I wiped out my Bearcat the day before Brodak last summer. Taking it down off the wall the day before the Fly-In did not work out well for me.

Ron King

>I have just purchased the Guardian carrier kit and I want to
>use it on a 3-wire system for speed control. I think the
>takeoffs with a idling engine and then rev up when I want to
>takeoff form a stooge makes a lot of sense for safety
>reasons. I have a Magnum 36A r/c engine to put on it.
>
>I have not seen any threads on the Brodak carrier kits so I
>was wandering if anyone has some hints on building the kit
>and if there are any watch out for's.

After reading all the threads, I decided to put another two cents in here. Last year, 2003, at Fargo, North Dakota, I watched several individuals flying throttle equiped planes. Several were the Sig Ultimate. The Gaurdian should make a decent stunter if you do the following: Enlarge the stab and elevator, Put in adjustable leadout guide, Also use the long arm bellcrank for throttle, which will give you leverage. As far as the handle, it overhangs no more than a CSC by Hunt. The wide spacing you will need for sensitivity. Also put in adjustable tip weight box. You don't need three ounces like us carrier flyers use. My Gaurdian set up for carrier with line slider and a ton of tip weight has done loops with the slider tripped, very exciting to say the least. But, most of all, if you are doing this for fun do it. Later, DOC