Does this happen to anybody else??

A couple of months ago I went to the doctor because my eyelids were puffy, irritated ,itchy, etc... This lasted for about a week and a half and the symptoms disappeared. Well, a couple of weeks ago the symptoms reappeared and it just so happens, the night before, I had used CA glue while building my Flight Streak wing.After putting 2 and 2 together, the CA was causing the problem because I had used it previously on another plane just prior to the first "outbreak". Please, no comments from the paranoid. I am not contacting the EPA or trying to get yor favorite CA pulled off the shelf. Just curious if anybody had any any other similar problems??

Yep. As our total exposure time is increasing, more people are showing signs of allergies to CA, as well as epoxy and polyester resin. The fumes from CA do a number on my eyes, too, if I get too close, so I have to be careful to keep the air moving. I use as little as possible.
Kelvin

Me too...I picked up a small cheap fan and have it set to "low" and direct the airflow across my work space so the CA fumes are carried away from my face....Bad stuff! Is Ambroid still available?

Tnx, Mike, the "Old Harley Man" [email protected]

Your cheap fan idea is a good one. CA really bothers me, and I was considering building my Green Box Nobler with Titebond and epoxy, although it will take forever. I saw some Ambroid in the LHS yesterday, and was tempted to get some. As I recall, it's good for wing ribs, etc.
Glen

>Me too...I picked up a small cheap fan and have it set to
>"low" and direct the airflow across my work space so the CA
>fumes are carried away from my face....Bad stuff! Is Ambroid
>still available?

Yes, Ambroid is still available. Remember, however, that this stuff continues to dry until it simply shrinks (or peels) away from the joint it is supposed to be holding. Everything has its price.

But has anybody tried the new "odorless" CAs? This is supposed to not cause the problems that you all are experiencing. If you have a problem, I would sure try it.

LAST EDITED ON Oct-26-04 AT 09:53 AM (CDT)
 
>>Me too...I picked up a small cheap fan and have it set to
>>"low" and direct the airflow across my work space so the CA
>>fumes are carried away from my face....Bad stuff! Is Ambroid
>>still available?
>
>Yes, Ambroid is still available. Remember, however, that
>this stuff continues to dry until it simply shrinks (or
>peels) away from the joint it is supposed to be holding.
>Everything has its price.
>
>But has anybody tried the new "odorless" CAs? This is
>supposed to not cause the problems that you all are
>experiencing. If you have a problem, I would sure try it.

I have not heard of the odorless CAs. Who sells them and are they as good at holding as the normal stuff?

LAST EDITED ON Oct-26-04 AT 10:34 AM (CDT)
 
>
>I have not heard of the odorless CAs. Who sells them and are
>they as good at holding as the normal stuff?

Virtually any vendor who sells regular CA will also sell the "User Friendly Odorless" ("UFO") type as well. The difference, as I understand it, is that regular CA is Methyl Cyanoacrylate and the UFO is Ethyl Cyanoacrylate. Less volatile due to the extra carbon in some chain somewhere. The UFO CA adhesives are in every way as good as the regular, but they typically cost something like twice as much. They also have the excellent property that they do not attack foam, making them *very* useful. I have used the UFO material with excellent results. Many folks who cannot tolerate regular CA can use the UFO product without ill effect, the main reason it is marketed, I believe. If you can't find it over the counter, I know that Composite Structure Technology (CST) sells it mail order. There is a ZAP UFO product, and I would bet that you can get it or some other UFO type from SIG.

FWIW,

Andy

Edit: Here's a link to the CST Cyanoacrylate Glue section, which lists UFO CA:

http://www.cstsales.com/CyanoacrylateGlue.htm

Yep. Never used the stinky stuff since the odorless came out - in the late 80's (Satellite City's UFO). Since then, every CA mfr has versions of the odorless stuff.

The Bob Smith product line includes a complete selection of odorless CA's - thin, medium, thick, etc. These are the same ones that every hobby shop uses to slap their own name on the bottles and sell.

My complaint is that it still tears up your fingers, and has all the other bad qualities, too - just no smell or gas.

Oderless is also safe to use on foam. I don't like it .... seems to be less aggressive and is not "instant."

Belive chemical reactions like this are cumulative. Once you show signs of reaction it will only get worse with continued exposure. The same can happen with epoxy. Switching glue might be the safe bet.

Mr. Neumann. How long do I have to wait until my Ambroid-built models fail in glue joints?

I still have a large stunter (.40 size) that I built in 1962. Seems to be in excellent shape. It was last flown about 4 years ago (and Brett flew it once in Redwood City).

AMBROID???? Man! don't you know??? That stuff...is what happened to us older guys...flying little airplanes around in circles on strings????

I have used the Odorless stuff and it dries in the bottle to a solid mass really quickly once the bottle is opened. It also cost twice as much as the regular stuff. I used to attach some spars to foam. But, it is odorless.

"I don't know about this tuned pipe business. I practiced on that thing until my lips turned blue, and I still can't play a stinkin note."
"Homer J. Simpson"

>I have used the Odorless stuff and it dries in the bottle to
>a solid mass really quickly once the bottle is opened. It
>also cost twice as much as the regular stuff. I used to
>attach some spars to foam. But, it is odorless.

A trick: Store your CA in the freezer between building sessions. Greatly extends the shelf life. Also, if you are storing your accelerator anywhere near the CA, you will indeed end up with bottles full of hardened glue! Keep them as far apart as you reasonably can. I always store CA with a new, unpunctured lid. Constant exposure to air/moisture will greatly diminish shelf life. Of course I have to remember to warm my glue, and screw on a different lid when I use it, but it keeps for at least 6 months this way.

FWIW,

Andy

CA fumes will cause all kinds of irritation to the eye tissues. I spilled some thin CA years ago in the hot Summer the fumes came up to BLAST my eyes.The redness & swelling was presant for 2 months.

Yep and some of the "new" balsa I sand will make me sneeze a bunch. My older balsa won't. The CA gives my eyes a real bad inflamation and a headache.
I don't why you keep knocking Ambroid Leonard. By the time it shrinks that much, the model must be twenty years old. LOL. Mine never make it that far. Also if you use too much or don't preglue, yep it will.
The point is to use different adhesives for different jobs. Then buy stock in glue companies and recoup your expenses> Ha.

Hey, The Smoothie I finished building in 1968 still has good solid Ambroid joints.
One our LHSs still carries a wide variety of Ambroid products, including the old amber cement, and a liquid plastic solvent type cement. Ambroid is still in usiness.
Some people seem to be more quickly affected by the CAs if they use the commercial spray accelerators. I know two people who said they got away from the affects by using a home-made accelerator using baking soda and water. They can't use CA for more than about 5 minutes if they use the store bought stuff, but they can work for several days a time if they use the home brew.

I must admit to never having Pre-glued with Ambroid as one should, but the only time I ever had a failure was a model someone had left in our club workroom at college. So we finished and flew it. Nobody knew it's vintage, but it was really old. It flew fine, but on a regular landing it returned to kit form. No parts broken, none still glued together. Really amazing!!!

I know some professional model makers for Mattel who can only use the UFO type glues due to extreme exposure to the regular types. You probably should be getting cautious about the stuff before you get sensitized in case you really need the good stuff in an emergency.

Standard CA fumes are highly irritating. Not that it helps, but it probably isn't an allergy, just normal irritation.

If I get more than a whiff of CA fumes I get a horrible runny nose/itchy eyes too. Thought I was dying of the flu a couple years ago. I was sick for a couple weeks. Turned out I was using too much CA with inadeqate ventilation. Stopped the CA and the symptoms cleared up in a couple of days.

A couple hints. Never use CA for large areas. That was mostly what got me into trouble.

If you do put it on glass cloth, or to stiffen soft balsa, immediately cover it with a plastic bag and hold the bag on until the glue is hard. The plastic contains most of the fumes.

The kicker can give you a hell of a headache too. Be just as careful with it as the glue.

My second ex-wife's family (the kids) all smoked dope. The house reeked of it. Mom used to dose herself with Visene before bed and whenever she woke up during the night.
One time she applied copiuos ammounts of CA instead!
Went to the ER where they pretty much pried her eyelids apart....enough tearing that her eyes were okay.

See Ya

>My second ex-wife's family (the kids) all smoked dope. The
>house reeked of it. Mom used to dose herself with Visene
>before bed and whenever she woke up during the night.
>One time she applied copiuos ammounts of CA instead!
>Went to the ER where they pretty much pried her eyelids
>apart....enough tearing that her eyes were okay.
>
>See Ya
>
>Peabody

Rich, Why did you put the CA in your 2nd ex's mom's medicine cabinet?

Do you have to ask?!

BIGS

" What constitutes the dignity of a craft is that it creates a fellowship, that it binds men together and fashions for them a common language. For there is but one problem - the problem of human relations."

After using Cyano glue rather abundantly one evening, (With the occasional painfull eyes and nose), that following night my nose started bleeding. I managed to stop it, but the next evening it started bleeding again and I had to go to hospital to have it stopped. 2 days later the same problem and they kept me in hospital for 2 days. They did some small surgery and since then the problem is gone, but I am a bit worried to use cyano glue again...