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Broken Fox Needle Valves

Stuka Stunt Main Forum · 9 of 9 known posts recovered

G Willie · Nov 13, 2004 02:36 PM

#0 source
I just saw a post on the Classifieds page from Rootbeard whose son had wiped out a NV on an outside loop. This reminded me of an essay I wrote for Cloud 9 in 1989. Maybe you'll like it:

Around 1957, we Beaver Falls fliers (Grey Hayes, Bill Moran, Eddie Staniek, sometimes Bernie Luger, and yours truly) graduated to big models with big engines. This meant a Fox .35 and a Sterling Ringmaster or F51, a PDQ Circus King, a J. Roberts Sabre, or something of similar ilk. The common denominator was that the planes were all stuntable (would fly upside down and do inside and outside loops) and were all profile models.

We all had mastered straight and level flight, wingovers, and inside loops. We had been able to do the wingovers on 15 foot long lines in the intersection at 14th street and 2nd avenue in front of my house. Serious stunting though, required longer lines and a big 40" wingspan model; thus the big profile models and the Fox .35s. These would be flown on 60 foot lines down at Moultrup's field (the local little league baseball park).

When a Fox .35 is mounted on a profile model, the exhaust points down at the landing gear. The needle valve is normally positioned up at the sky; to put it on the exhaust side produces badly burned fingers as your hand must be under the exhaust to adjust it.

During normal flying this position is no problem as one normally lands on the wheels. While learning to fly upside down and do outside loops however, we very often would land (crash) upside down and this wipes out the top mounted needle valve. Without a needle valve, the Fox .35 will not run.

In 1989 this probably could not be considered a problem. I don't think most RCers of today have ever broken a needle valve. If they have, the whole plane was probably trashed and they didn't even notice the needle valve was broken.

In 1957, especially in June when the summer vacation had hardly started, a broken Fox .35 needle valve was an immense problem. We only had one hobby shop, McCue's, or Mac's as we called it. Mac just didn't stock handfulls of Fox needle valves. He had no way of knowing that 3 or 4 of us would all attempt inverted flight on the same afternoon and each require a new needle valve the next day.

We thus learned to share needle valves. While we shared we of course tried to invent alternate solutions. One of the Perfect mounting bolts fit the spraybar, but we never seemed to be able to get it filed just right to provide smooth adjustment. A handy hint of the day (Fixit Wright's??) said to file a weak spot in the upper part of the needle valve so it would break there instead of down at the spraybar. This kind of worked, but the soldered repair had a way of disappearing in flight; we 14 year olds weren't NASA solderers. Perfect also made a coil spring needle valve extension, but it tended to wrap up and let go, thus preventing fine adjustment (the proper setting was always or - one click for where you were). You didn't dare let it stick straight up, it would vibrate right into the prop.

One way or another, we all did learn to fly upside down and do outside loops. Those of us that stuck with it built full fuselage models and didn't have to worry as often about breaking needle valves.

Sometimes now when I think I have a problem, I think back to when it was June and there wasn't a Fox .35 needle valve in Beaver Falls and then I realize I don't really have a problem after all.

Bill Mohrbacher

Lou_Crane · Nov 13, 2004 02:45 PM

#1 source
Bill,

Thanks! Fascinating tale...

BTW, the stunt Fox NVA is threaded 3-48. Problem is that that size may be on the way out of existence... If anyone can find a blacked steel Allen head 3-48 bolt about 3/4 to one inch long, it will fill the spraybar threads closer than a shiny slot-head 3-48 - or even the original needle. It also may be easier to 'turn' down to a decent taper...

But, today, we all know how to solder, and how to spell O.S., right?

\BEST\LOU

dennis · Nov 13, 2004 03:02 PM

#2 source
>Bill,
>
>Thanks! Fascinating tale...
>
>BTW, the stunt Fox NVA is threaded 3-48. Problem is that
>that size may be on the way out of existence... If anyone
>can find a blacked steel Allen head 3-48 bolt about 3/4 to
>one inch long, it will fill the spraybar threads closer than
>a shiny slot-head 3-48 - or even the original needle. It
>also may be easier to 'turn' down to a decent taper...
>
>But, today, we all know how to solder, and how to spell
>O.S., right?


The sad part is that the cox motors were designed to be mounted with 3/48 bolts also the Fox 049/07/09/10/15 and a lot of the older 1/2 a's from the 50's.
Looks like we will be using metric sized screws in the future as 2/56 are really too small for me.

Al Rabe · Nov 13, 2004 04:43 PM

#3 source
I don't know if anyone cares, but I think I have a number of Fox needle valves and some assemblies.

Al

jim ivey · Nov 13, 2004 07:51 PM

#7 source
mmm th originals i believe had a flat on one side (see below)... werent even tapered ...but with a screw u cant just file a flat on it ..but u can stick it in a drill chuck(carefully of course) and with a "smooth" file ... file it into th taper u want ...it doesnt need to be a sharp point ... polish it a little with some 400 solder a small spring on with a knob of some sort ...keep it short so it dont viberate and ur in business ... jim

LeagueCityRalph · Nov 13, 2004 05:10 PM

#4 source
LAST EDITED ON Nov-13-04 AT 05:11 PM (CST)
 
>Bill,
>
>Thanks! Fascinating tale...
>
>BTW, the stunt Fox NVA is threaded 3-48. Problem is that
>that size may be on the way out of existence... If anyone
>can find a blacked steel Allen head 3-48 bolt about 3/4 to
>one inch long, it will fill the spraybar threads closer than
>a shiny slot-head 3-48 - or even the original needle. It
>also may be easier to 'turn' down to a decent taper...
>
>But, today, we all know how to solder, and how to spell
>O.S., right?

+ + + + +

Try:

http://www.microfasteners.com/catalog/products/SSCSCA.cfm - About a third of the way down the page . . .

Ralph Wenzel

elmores · Nov 13, 2004 05:24 PM

#5 source
You can (often) remove the remains of the broken nv from the spraybar by pushing the soft pad of you thumb against the remains of the nv and turning.

That way all you need is a new needle and the spraybar can be reused!

Tony

Harleyman · Nov 13, 2004 05:37 PM

#6 source
I have fixed one by cutting it apart at the bend and removing approx ½ “ of the length then soldering in a very stiff spring in between.

Chris

cyclone · Nov 16, 2004 07:22 PM

#8 source
I cut off the end and bend over the stub like a Super Tigre needle.I have been flying profiles for years this way without one broken needle.Jim Kraft

Jim Kraft