Just an observation

Just got my new issue of SN and read what everybodies been talking about. I took the time to look over all the contest results and pictures in this issue to see what was being flown. There just wasn't that many Brodak planes listed. Is it possible that this just might be part of why he wants to offer Pampa to all skill levels? Most of his kits are of the entry level type. Even his engine, while I have heard it is mostly good, caters price wise to entry level flyers. I can't think of anything that would help his company more. I do believe that John Brodak has done alot of good things for U/C but I find it somewhat offensive when I constantly read that he has done more than anyone else. What about the kit makers such as RSM, Walter Umland, Larry Richards and all the others I can't think of right now? Can you really even compare these kits to Brodaks for wood selection? I think that what we have here is a severe conflict of interest that is at best self serving to one individual and has nothing to offer Pampa in the long run.

Bill

>Just got my new issue of SN and read what everybodies been
>talking about. I took the time to look over all the contest
>results and pictures in this issue to see what was being
>flown. There just wasn't that many Brodak planes listed. Is
>it possible that this just might be part of why he wants to
>offer Pampa to all skill levels? Most of his kits are of the
>entry level type. Even his engine, while I have heard it is
>mostly good, caters price wise to entry level flyers. I
>can't think of anything that would help his company more. I
>do believe that John Brodak has done alot of good things for
>U/C but I find it somewhat offensive when I constantly read
>that he has done more than anyone else. What about the kit
>makers such as RSM, Walter Umland, Larry Richards and all
>the others I can't think of right now? Can you really even
>compare these kits to Brodaks for wood selection? I think
>that what we have here is a severe conflict of interest that
>is at best self serving to one individual and has nothing to
>offer Pampa in the long run.

Bill,

You and I are on the same page.

However, it is worth noting there has always been a conflict of interest here, and we all knew this prior to John being voted into office. Prior to the election I even went so far as to say--here on SSW--that no amateur organization like PAMPA should ever be so foolish as to elect a main supplier of product to a position of authority.

But a conflict of interest simply existing is not a huge problem, can certainly be handled in an honorable manner and without repercussions.

Unfortunately, it appears to me as if we have well and truly entered the "Now-It's-A-Problem" zone.

I wish it weren't so (note to self: write again to Frank McMillan, thanking him for his superb leadership of PAMPA); no matter what happens I see little good to come from it. And a certain amount of damage, repairable but still there at this time, is sure to take place.

Dan,

That was what I was saying. I imagine that Bordak is an honorable guy and that he understands the conflict of interest that is present. But he hasn't said anything that leads me to believe that the appearance of impropriety isn't valid. Be nice if he stated (in Stunt News, here, in a letter, whatever) that he understands that he is a supplier and that his actions could be seen as a move to improve sales of his private company and that he his working to make sure that the conflict of interest that is present will not interfere with his duties as an officer of PAMPA.

Bill, I agree that there is at least the appearance of a conflict of interest. And I have some real concerns about what appears to be going on in PAMPA.

But let's compare apples to apples. Larry, Walter, Tom D, and others make wonderful kits. But they are not collectively the sort of thing a beginner will buy and build. The average beginner might not even appreciate the difference. And without readily available, modest-priced equipment that the beginner can access easily, pretty soon there won't be any customers for the high-quality kits. There is a vital need for the kind of product line that Brodak has out there. So let's don't throw the baby out with the bathwater. You don't have to like John, just remember that he's about the only game in town.

LAST EDITED ON Nov-16-04 AT 01:53 PM (CST)
 
I think the majority of Brodaks kits are competitive in the various classes. I guess it depends what you really consider entry level. Is a Oriental, Nobler, Vector, Strega, Legacy, Smoothie, Nobler, Thunderbird, Olympic, Cardinal, Viking, and Pathfinder in Ted Fancher’s hands considered entry level?

Conflict of Interest, well that depends if you believe he is trying to turn PAMPA in a general interest org to support his business. I personally don’t buy into this semi-popular theory on this forum. Let's face it, John Brodak isn't going to get rich from selling c/l stuff regardless of PAMPA's structure. Give me a break!!!!

What has he done for C/L hobby, I think that’s hard to measure. But I do believe he has done more than most in this area to promote the control line hobby. Let’s face it, he won the election for President of PAMPA easily, so most supported him at least at the time of the election.

I, too, believe that John has put out some very good quality products for our hobby. But I think we need to distinguish what he has done for the hobby and what he is not attempting to do as president of PAMPA.

That aside, as nice as his kits are for the price, with him now jumping on the bandwagon to produce the ARFs in the very same models as he is producing in kits, who is going to buy the kits? I can see in a very short time his reducing the number of kits that he produces and ultimately his being primarily a seller of ARFs. Is this going to be good for the hobby?

Not if it includes building. And if you don't build, you don't know how to repair--remember, the ARF's don't even come with plans. And if you don't know how to repair, how long are you going to stick to the hobby when our airplanes become expendable at $100 a pop (or crash)?

These days arf’s are required for survival. Let’s face it, less not more people are building arf’s when compared to kits. I hardly think anyone can pin this on John Brodak, it’s the direction the entire hobby has been going for 15 years.

No doubt, less kit's will be sold in the future but that's our fault not Brodak.

Just wait for the Vector and Strega arf's to hit the market!

>These days arf’s are required for survival.

Well, that's a different thread, but I can't see how you come to that conclusion. The huge build-up in Stunt participation numbers happened LONG BEFORE ARFs hit the scene in the last year and a half. I have seen NO evidence of increased participation as the result of the existence of ARFS. And PAMPA membership continues to go down slowly more-or-less in line with the predictions of 4 years ago.

>Let’s face it,
>less not more people are building arf’s when compared to
>kits. I hardly think anyone can pin this on John Brodak,
>it’s the direction the entire hobby has been going for 15
>years.

Huh? Until about a year and a half ago, there was no such thing as ARFs in this event. Unless you count Cox models. You are grossly overstating.mistating the issue.

Like I said, it's definitely a different thread. So let's start that again, let it go 3 posts, then have Len, properly, shut it down.

> Well, that's a different thread, but I can't see how you
>come to that conclusion. The huge build-up in Stunt
>participation numbers happened LONG BEFORE ARFs hit the
>scene in the last year and a half. I have seen NO evidence
>of increased participation as the result of the existence of
>ARFS. And PAMPA membership continues to go down slowly
>more-or-less in line with the predictions of 4 years ago.
>

Brett for a business to survive these days arfs are required. Speaking in terms of R/C and C/L. Really no evidence?? I saw it at our contest this year. Maybe it's just an east coast thing. )

> Huh? Until about a year and a half ago, there was no
>such thing as ARFs in this event. Unless you count Cox
>models. You are grossly overstating.mistating the issue.

Huh?? Once again considering both R/C and C/L. I flew/fly rc pattern and IMAC....NOBODY builds from a kit. Everything is ARC or ARF. Look at your R/C field, 95% of the planes are ARC or ARF. Your grossly under estimating how arf's will dominate C/L in the near future. Sorry Brett, but I 've seen this in R/C and will see it again in C/L....very shortly.

>Huh?? Once again considering both R/C and C/L. I flew/fly rc
>pattern and IMAC....NOBODY builds from a kit. Everything is
>ARC or ARF. Look at your R/C field, 95% of the planes are
>ARC or ARF. Your grossly under estimating how arf's will
>dominate C/L in the near future. Sorry Brett, but I 've seen
>this in R/C and will see it again in C/L....very shortly.

Circle burner:
I really feel you are underestimating the character type and personality profile that has historically been attracted to our complex and creative event we call "stunt"...It does not attract the likes that are the "norm" in areas like RC flying. It never has, and quite frankly, hopefully, never will.!!!This is not a negative critique against RC, just pointing out the trends and differentiation between the two similar but distinct hobbies.....For the life of me I cannot see the likes of stunt flyers resorting to ARFS because, well that is what happens based on what occurred in RC....The prestiege/history and integrity of its members will influence the future and direction of stunt, not trends based around convience or another hobbies plight.
Thanks David

LAST EDITED ON Nov-16-04 AT 05:03 PM (CST)
 
>Circle burner:
>I really feel you are underestimating the character type and
>personality profile that has historically been attracted to
>our complex and creative event we call "stunt"...It does not
>attract the likes that are the "norm" in areas like RC
>flying. It never has, and quite frankly, hopefully, never
>will.!!!This is not a negative critique against RC, just
>pointing out the trends and differentiation between the two
>similar but distinct hobbies.....For the life of me I cannot
>see the likes of stunt flyers resorting to ARFS because,
>well that is what happens based on what occurred in
>RC....The prestiege/history and integrity of its members
>will influence the future and direction of stunt, not trends
>based around convience or another hobbies plight.
>Thanks David

Well David, r/c pattern is not that much different. When I started flying r/c pattern in 79, I never thought such a complex and creative event called pattern would be filled will arf's. Stick around because you will see the same thing in the complex and creative thing we call stunt. Wait until your composite ships start hitting the market for c/l, molded wings are coming. It's not a matter of integrity, I fly a molded IMAC ship, does that mean I have less integrity....not.

Don't get me wrong, I really like to build my own airplanes. I really don't care all that much for arf's. Nothing better than a plane you built yourself, it's a matter of pride with me. But I also have to admit I have a ARF Cardinal and it really flies very well.

.
>
>
> I fly a molded IMAC ship, does that mean I have less
>integrity....not.
>
>Don't get me wrong, I really like to build my own airplanes.
>I really don't care all that much for arf's. Nothing better
>than a plane you built yourself, it's a matter of pride with
>me. But I also have to admit I have a ARF Cardinal and it
>really flies very well.

Circle Burner,
I hope you are not confusing integrity with personal issues.What I meant is that the integrity of the event will uphold and influence the future..Flying an ARF is not a reflection of your personal integrity..However, the integrity of the this event has been molded by its founding individuals, current members included..Certain aspects of flying stunt are rooted in presentation/appearance..I am a firm believer that even though I live in a fast paced culture, where trends are often influenced by convience and instant gratification. The event of stunt through all of the conflict and distortions will continue to thrive in its own usual manner...Where change will be necessary and made, but institutional/historical factors that make are hobby so unique and challenging will remain.
I am sorry if I was not clear regarding integrity and flying ARFS..

Thanks David

I hope it doesn't become ARF to soon, I like kits, I can improve my building and enjoyment of the hobby. I would rather work on my planes than watch TV. There seems to be a place for both.

There just wasn't that many Brodak planes listed. Is
>it possible that this just might be part of why he wants to
>offer Pampa to all skill levels? Most of his kits are of the
>entry level type. Even his engine, while I have heard it is
>mostly good, caters price wise to entry level flyers. I
>can't think of anything that would help his company more.

Ahhhh...yes, you have discovered John Brodaks evil plan. To RULE the world through the sale of CL stunt kits.

There are TENS OF DOLLARS TO BE MADE HERE!!!
<wringing hands vigorously>.

Oh my Gawd!!!!

Dan, and you say MY IQ is dropping... You should know the big bucks that comes from the niche markets.

LAST EDITED ON Nov-16-04 AT 02:34 PM (CST)
 
'zilla,

It isn't an issue of making money and I'm not suggesting that Brodak is doing this. As I said, I'm sure he's an honest guy. But it IS a conflict of interest. As Dan noted, it's not neccesarily a problem. But it would be nice if Mr. Brodak acknowledged the conflict and stated that he would make every effort to avoid acts that would tend to suggest impropriety.

Edit: This wasn't intended as an attack on Mr. Brodak's character, intentions or his company. I think this is separate issue from other PAMPA conflicts that have been bandied about here. I just think that as a major supplier of CL products, it behooves him to make it clear that he won't try to use the office for self promotion. I doubt he is for all the reasons stated, but it still could look bad.

It's a minor side issue. I'll dorp it at that.

>Just got my new issue of SN and read what everybodies been
>talking about. I took the time to look over all the contest
>results and pictures in this issue to see what was being
>flown. There just wasn't that many Brodak planes listed. Is
>it possible that this just might be part of why he wants to
>offer Pampa to all skill levels? Most of his kits are of the
>entry level type. Even his engine, while I have heard it is
>mostly good, caters price wise to entry level flyers. I
>can't think of anything that would help his company more. I
>do believe that John Brodak has done alot of good things for
>U/C but I find it somewhat offensive when I constantly read
>that he has done more than anyone else. What about the kit
>makers such as RSM, Walter Umland, Larry Richards and all
>the others I can't think of right now? Can you really even
>compare these kits to Brodaks for wood selection?

No offense intended, but I think you might be missing the point. Whether John Brodak has done a lot, a little, or nothing, doesn't seem to the be relevant issue. Either for or against his proposals. I think we'd all be better served by sticking to the issue of whether these proposals, and the way the process is being followed are beneficial and correct for the organization.

His history in the event is short, but that only comes into play when evaluating his proposals when you consider the likelihood of understanding the real problems and thus whether or not he might have worthwhile and well-informed solutions.

His motivation is speculative, and while those speculations might serve to set an emotional state, I caution everyone on any side of this issue to to their level best to keep this out of the debate. I know I don't appreciate being demonized (as I and many other are right now) as "elitists" "hateful", etc.'s any more than anyone else, but responding in kind it does not advance the debate in any useful way.

And, since I know this is going straight back to the "brain trust" seconds after I hit "post message", I'll once again put it in black and white:

disagreeing with John Brodak (or anyone else) IS NOT the same as "an attack" on John.

Noting FACTUAL documented examples of things you take issue with IS NOT an "attack" on John.

EVERY MEMBER has a right to have an opinion on these proposals and their handling, and being John Brodak DOES NOT make him off-limits for legitimate counter-argument and criticism. Of course, everyone should be off-limits when it comes to personal attacks, but SOME PEOPLE DON'T SEEM TO DRAW THE DISTINCTION. Or don't want to, because accusing critics as ATTACKERS tends to DEFLECT criticism and DIVIDE people into warring camps.

Having said all that, I remain convinced that the proposals themselves are not AT ALL in the interest of the organization, and the *way* they have been handled (along with numerous other items), is, frankly, borderline catastrophic. The resulting firestorm is all to obvious, and, I don't think it needed to be that way.

LAST EDITED ON Nov-16-04 AT 08:19 PM (CST)
 
"...and I don't think it needed to be that way." Truer words never spoken. Suppose we had opened our SN and read- "I've got some ideas that I think have merit for the good of PAMPA. Here they are:...etc, etc. I'm going to contact ALL the Trustees, Trustees Elect, and Directors and present them for discussion. Then we'll vote. If they like my ideas, they will go out for a membership vote". There's only one reason that didn't happen and in time, we'll all know. Best regards, dale gleason

>"...and I don't think it needed to be that way." Truer words
>never spoken. Suppose we had opened our SN and read- "I've
>got some ideas that I think have merit for the good of
>PAMPA. Here they are:...etc, etc. I'm going to contact ALL
>the Trustees, Trustees Elect, and Directors and present them
>for discussion. Then we'll vote. If they like my ideas, they
>will go out for a membership vote". There's only one reason
>that didn't happen and in time, we'll all know. Best
>regards, dale gleason

.....golf clap.....

I could not agree with you more. GREAT POST!

Look at the reps. I bet he has a majority right now. He should be bending over backward to make sure that anything he wants to do is on the up and up all the way. That way that other thread and more like them wont happen. Anyone who has any time in PAMPA knows making any kind of a change will cause a stink, big or small there will be a certain stink raised. So do it as gracefully as possible and you will be a savior. Do it like a bull and you will eventually get the horns.

Please tell me you're joking!

John Brodak has contrived his Evil Plot (tm) to get more of "his" airplanes into competitions (and thereby grow <even> rich<er>)?

Please.

How devilshy clever of John! AND how devilishly clever of him to supply ARFs to a market which is demanding them. Think of the demand after they start winning all the contests!

(Dan, please explain where this sort of behavior might fit into the scheme of free enterprise and capitalism?)

Your theory is feasible, but only if Dick Cheney were CEO of Brodak, Inc.

[photo not recovered: 3e69bb3870f12ad5.jpg]

"I always voted at my party's call, and I never thought of thinking for myself at all." -Gilbert & Sullivan, from HMS Pinafore

Bill, Et al:

Wait a minute! Step back and look at this WITHOUT worrying about someone else's profit or personality. The real heart of what is left is that new flyers or, heaven forbid, competitors who haven't "paid their dues" might just be some kind of a problem.

How terrible! We might just have a surge in entries at the beginner and intermediate levels. A few flyers might work to higher levels in less then (fill in the blank) years. Some may not have the commitment to stay in for the long run, and, to read some of the responses. You'd think that was going to turn us all into pillars of salt to read some comments.

Part of that unwashed throng will become good flyers, some possibly great. Some will become fine builders and some not. Some will gravitate to leadership positions and might even rock the boat a bit, and some others will take great offense! And that, sirs, is called GROWTH.

Most of US started with Firebabys, Scientific hollow logs, or plastic ready to fly's. How can any tool that get people into OUR PART of the hobby be such an evil thing? Without the means of early success such as the Brodak kits and the other entry level products, very few of us would be building the magnificent kits by Walter or Eric at RSM.

I like to win, but nothing would thrill me more than see someone that I nudged into an ARF Streak to "light the fire", work his way up to the point of beating me.

In my end of the world they call that "PROMOTING COMPETITION" !

The point I was trying to make here in my "I am not so good at getting it across way" is that this surge in Pampa memebership might look good. However back when I wrote "Joe Sport Flyer" I tried to say why we as Sport Flyers shouldn't be allowed to help direct Pampa's path. I remember when several people stated that since they are members of Pampa that it was their given right to vote on all proposals whether they competed or not. Why would you want to? I don't get it. If you are not competing then why would you feel that you should vote on changes that you are not involved in? Just because you can? This kind of mentality reminds me of Elementary School.

Bill

From 'zilla we have his retort:

"Ahhhh...yes, you have discovered John Brodaks evil plan. To RULE the world through the sale of CL stunt kits.

There are TENS OF DOLLARS TO BE MADE HERE!!!
<wringing hands vigorously>.

Oh my Gawd!!!!

Dan, and you say MY IQ is dropping... You should know the big bucks that comes from the niche markets."

The City Smasher

Having gone back and read again my response to Bill, there would appear to be a huge disconnect here. While I thank Brad for trying to fill in the blanks, it would be ever so much more helpful to just stick to the issues.

That there is an apparent conflict of interest is not being disputed.

That there have been actions taken, actions proposed which I do not take as being in the best interests of PAMPA, and which may indeed be of benefit to a privately-held company should no longer be in dispute.

The question is, What do we do about it? Squawk at each other, especially when it involves creative writing which is a bit too creative, not even particularly clever? I think not.

I have made it exceedingly clear--as if it were needed, he and I being of the same mind when it comes to PAMPA, Stunt and good eats--to my District Director how I feel about some of the more salient issues. I expect he is working on my behalf to see that rules are followed, procedures are in place for a successful resolution to current conflicts.

>Having gone back and read again my response to Bill, there
>would appear to be a huge disconnect here. While I thank
>Brad for trying to fill in the blanks, it would be ever so
>much more helpful to just stick to the issues.
>
>That there is an apparent conflict of interest is not being
>disputed.

I am disputing it.

The whole thing is silly, that is my point.

John need not be the PAMPA Prez to dominate and expand the CLPA kit and ARF market. He already was already doing it.

The idea that PAMPA would have anywhere near the effect on CLPA participation as the availability of the ARF's and kits themselves is laughable.

How many ARF's did they sell in two weeks? ALL OF THEM????

You guys need to visit a hobby shop on occassion. People who have never heard of PAMPA have heard of Top Flite and Brodak . In this manner Brodak has occomplished more for CLPA and its exposure to the masses than PAMPA ever could. He did not need to be Prez or change the bylaws to accomplish these deeds either.

I seem to remember everyone on this board saying ARF's would never see the light of day in CLPA. WELL NO IS SAYING THAT ANYMORE!!! Guess it took someone like John to make that a reality.

How quickly this community can judge. Guess it is part of the sport.

Not disputed?

Dan, I dispute that any definitive action has been taken which harms PAMPA or changes it. If I'm wrong, please point it out - not speculation or projections, something that has ACTUALLY occurred to change the organization.

Also, I would like to point out: we now have 12 Bylaws (right?), which guide PAMPA's operations.

Please, please point out specifically what Bylaw(s) has been violated by electing John Brodak (or any other businessman or profession) President. Or point out where any procedure was violated which would make his election illegal?

Also, point out where the President is prohibited from appointing committees and other groups "as he deems appropriate" to study issues?

Also, point out how ANY PAMPA Bylaw has been changed, or might be changed without a vote of 2/3 of the membership?

Can you also voice any specific objections to having rigorous accounting, money handling, or ballot counting procedures in place, defined by our bylaws, to assure PAMPA's non-profit business status remains intact?

What do you suppose the new specific rules will be for restricting PAMPA membership? Who in the EC will propose them? (I haven't flown Stunt for a couple of years - can I remain a member?)

Will we have a new bylaw or two properly restricting the contents of the Stunt News?

Actually, I seem to have a lot of questions about this new PAMPA!

Can I propose an Inactive Membership category, where we join, get counted numerically as being in the organization, receive Stunt News, but are completely inert as membership activities, unlisted in the database? I'm interested in such an arrangement, which seems more and more attractive.

Also, I'd like to say I don't appreciate being clumped into or out of any particular group by default, simply because I disagree with the lynching party. Others are others, I am I.

[photo not recovered: 3e69bb3870f12ad5.jpg]

"If you need four screws for the job, the first three are easy to find." -The N-1 Law

LAST EDITED ON Nov-16-04 AT 07:10 PM (CST)
 
Bill (Crash2much),
They have the right to vote because they paid their $35 dues just like everyone else.

LAST EDITED ON Nov-16-04 AT 07:28 PM (CST)
 
Dirty Dan,
If there was a potential conflict of interest with John Brodak being president, every voter knew about it well before the election took place. This WAS handled with an election by all participating PAMPA members. The end result was John Brodak: President. The majority have spoken. There is nothing else to handle concerning this subject. If the majority don't like what he does, they will send him packin' next time. Any "Harm" he can dish out in one term can be undone in the next...... Provided that is what the majority wants.

Steve Hulse, I too have paid my $35 but I don't think it is right nor fair that I vote on changes in patterns/events if I am not actively participating in them. Why should we concern ourselves with what the competitors are doing if we aren't competing?

Bill

For months now I have sat back and read the endless posts about the "Brodak for/as PAMPA president" contoversies without wanting to jump into the mix and add to the ingredients... but here I find a thread that intrigues me to the point of weighing in...

There are really only two points that have me bothered by John Brodak as pres...

First I should mention that I am currently a sport flyer with the intention of competing in the next season. A member of "The Knights of the Round Circle" for less than a year,(does that make me a part of the West Coast Linch Mob?) so although I have not earned the "right to vote" I do have a vested interest in the future of PAMPA and the original intent and effectiveness for which it was formed.

For the record I would support Crash2much's proposal that anyone not interested in competing should refrain from voting on proposals/personel that will affect those who do care.

Now the two points... First one up for me is the very well timed letter sent by John Brodak (J.B.) just before the election to the PAMPA mailing list. Keith Trostle had no time to respond to the bulk of those members who received J.B.'s letter. It would seem to me "the one with the most resourses (AKA money) wins!" J.B.'s well writen, well timed campaign letter certainly swayed some members who had no such contact from an equally (if not more so) articulate candidate...

Point two... J.B. is obviously a successful businessman. One that would have been wise to avoid the APPEARANCE of a conflict of interest...Sadly he chose to jump into this controversy with both feet! Should I be comfortable with that?

I appreciate Brodaks contribution to the hobby... I have no problem with Brodak kits (I am a beginner) I certainly appreciate the supporting products supplied by Brodak. Brodak's paints are front row quality, that's great! I hope that J.B. makes millions on his C/L products! That would be great too!!

But I am disappointed that for all J.B.'s business dealings and contributions it was not a prudent move to push for the PAMPA president seat given the obvious conflict and now the endless controversies... Hate to say it, but I saw it coming...I just hope that J.B. will not be remembered for being the pres. that split PAMPA...

well if he wants to make it so arfs are allowed...that should be ok....but no points for th airplane...well maybe a 10 point maximum if he didnt slop glue all over th place puttin it togeather...no if no contruction at all was done... that way th guys ability to fly would be judged ... less 50 possible (what it use to be when i flew)points for originality,realism,contruction and finish cause they didnt build or design th airplane ...if they can stiil compete with that kind of handicap....which im sure some guys could ...oh well...cant hurt....in fact it would probably be good for th sport...cause anyone could go by an arf and be competitive(but hed never win 1st place in th nats with th s.o.b.)....we could still kick their butts...espeacially with a 50 point advantage for building or own aiplanes...see easy solution...he changes some rules...we change some rules...and everyone is accommodated....jim ivey(west coast is th best coast)

Oh My God!

I just found this on the Brodak website and I KNEW you guys would want to talk about it. Talk about conflict of interest, this guy has let his leadership go to his head. Only $14.95, think I'll order two....

Gee, Bill.

We Alaskans and those residents of Hawaii, Puerto Rico, and even other countries, or even Canada, might feel a bit slighted if we were sensitive types.

This is all getting rather tedious.

The suggestion that Brodak equipment is predominately entry level is amazing.

Sure the product range covers all bases but I wonder how the designers of Strega, Vector 40, Pathfinder, Legacy, Cardinal and Olympic feel about seeing their designs described thus?

A quick look over the Technology Review of Open and Advanced entries at this year's Nats only mentions three kits specifically, one each from RSM, Ultra Hobby Products and Brodak!

In Classic and Old Time we can only wonder about the history of the models because only the model names are listed but for engines, there seem to be about as many Brodak 40s as there are any other except FP-40.

As for kits in the pipeline, John Brodak is not cutting back on his kit offerings. Rather, he is expanding the range of laser-cut kits.

As for the future of PAMPA, we were all sport fliers once. Some choose to remain so, others elect to compete.

As for ARFs, they will speed my entry to the ranks with better models but I was more successful with my own designs than the British kits that dominated the scene in Oz 40 years ago and I want to do the same again.

Currently in my computer are semi-complete CAD drawings for a Classic legal Oz classic, one original from me, an as yet unseen new model from one of the senior US designers and a couple of redrawn, re-engineeered older designs that are finish drawn and await prototyping to prove the structural modifications and component drawings for laser-cutting before going into production.

There will always be people happy to fly ARFs but there will always be those who want the satisfaction of flying models they build themselves whether from kits, plans or their own designs.

And there is room for everybody.