Why do we fly counterclockwise?

Just one of those "I wonder why we do it this way?" questions.

Kim Elmore

AFAIK, it's a right-handed thing...when flying right-handed, counterclockwise tends to put the airplane directly in front; clockwise tends to put the pilot slightly behind the plane, as left-handed flyers are aware of. It's easily compensated for (re: those successful left-handers) but just one more example of the world's right-handed bias. Seems to me clockwise would be more logical since engine torque would then work for you rather than against you. Or did early engines run clockwise (from front)?
--Ray

If you do a wingover flying counter clockwise, you can do the entire maneuver with your feet planted. Now try to start one from the inverted position (flying clockwise) and see if you can do the entire maneuver while keeping your feet planted. (Just one example of where it is easier from "this direction" than from "that".)

(Edit. I make much boo-boo and stated "clockwise" in the last paragraph when I meant "counter clockwise" in the first instance. It has been repaired.)

I fly counter-clockwise and do the reverse wingover with my feet planted. Hmmm

It didn't matter to him. Same as George Alrich

Now I'll read the rest of the posts

BOO-BOO noted

Thanks for posting that, Floyd. Thought my old-timers was acting up again. I remember watching Jim fly three Fireballs on Floats between heats of the miniature Gold Cup Races (tethered model hydroplanes) at Green Lake in downtown Seattle a hundred or so years ago. I was certain he was flying CCW.

I have a vivid recollection of Jim Walker flying his Fireball at a vacant lot in South Gate, CA (Los Angeles county). He arrived in his Chrysler station wagon and flew a Fireball with his U-Reely. This was in 1947. I was just a teen kid trying to fly C/L without too many crashes. Jim did his "u-Reely" thing, launching the model with his left hand while the U-Reely in his right hand. A couple of frantic pivots until he pressed the button on the handle to let out the lines. We are absolutely amazed! Pretty soon the Fireball was out there at 50' and doing loops! To conclude, Jim cranked the U-Reely and ultimately caught the still running O&R 23 in his hand. The model never touched the ground, which was overgrown in weeds about 4 feet tall.

Such events are impressed into memory and they seem like I can play them back like a video. Details like flying right/left. etc. are perfectly clear in my memory. And that was almost 60 years ago!

Floyd Carter (age 71 last October)

At least one excellent lefty also flies counterclockwise-upright, Bart Klapinski.

Learning to fly control line is much like learning to fly stunt. It becomes a reflex. With morse code, you hear the sound and write the letter, you never think Dit, dah. With our model airplanes you become conditioned to know when the plane is flying one direction that down is up and up is down. Your brain inputs the hand deflection without your ever thinking. And once you are conditioned that way, it just doesn't want to work the other way again. A noted flyer who learned to fly clockwise only because the person who taught him flew clockwise because the person who taught him...well, anyway, after learning to fly clockwise he said he once tried to convert himself back the other way. After losing a couple of planes he decided he wouldn't try any more.

you don't have enough planes

Use George's trick: turn the handle upside down!

I suspect, if ANYONE could actually pull this off fairly well, it might be Bart Klapinski..

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"I had a lot of pimples too. One day I fell asleep in a library. I woke up and a blind man was reading my face." -Rodney Dangerfield

Actually, in combat, carrier, and racing, you are required to fly counter-clockwise. I believe this was based on horse racing and car racing (which was based on horse racing).

In stunt, scale, and speed, you can fly any way you want. As mentioned before, there is a torque advantage during takeoff if you go clockwise (or fly CCW and use a funny crankshaft). Some carrier guys spend big bucks to buy funny cranks.

As a long-time combat flyer, I'm just as comfortable either way. Incidently, in combat-speed contests, I've ALWAYS got a higher speed clockwise.

I've seen some models built as... "ambidextrous"? It had LG on bottom and topside. I suppose you could fly it in any direction - depending on how you held the handle.

Torque is the reason think about it.

In combat, it gives him an advantage inverted.

The threads reporting flyers using a handle upside down had a painful ending for me. I was once called out into the circle to fly a friends plane. I took the handle and immediately was in trouble and didn't save the plane. He then informed me that he had learned to fly with the handle upside down and didn't everyone fly that way. Incidentally I can fly clockwise but I don't think my pattern would be any better then counter clockwise. That ought to tell you something.
Dennis

Funny, when I first learned to ride a unicycle I learned to turn right before I learned to turn left. It's another reflex thing. you just learn to do it. you don't think about it.

Yeah, doesn't everybody. Right now it is stored in Matt's garage.

I used to ride it around the block but people would stare at you kind of funny. Hey, I was a grown man when I learned how to ride it (that is if I ever admitted to growing up).

Do they fly clockwise south of the equator?

My clocks all have lite-up numbers.

I think you have hit upon the answer as to why we now fly the "other" direction. Just think, in the "old" days when you had clocks that had hands that point at numbers, you could watch the second hand (why is it called a second hand when there are actually three?) move around and people called that "clockwise". Thinking that was the correct way to fly, people flew that direction.

Then along came digital. Now if you watch a digital clock, you will notice that the numbers change from right to left. The right number will count up from 0 to 9, and then the number to its left will move with it when it returns to 0. The number that is second from the left counts up from 0 to 6 and then the number to its left moves with it.

So, as you can clearly see, "clockwise" is not the other direction and that is why we fly from right to left.

It is really simple when you think of it. We are still flying "clockwise"

I'm naturally right-handed, but I always switch to left after takeoff in racing events. 5 MPH, easy.

How can you get a 5 mph advantage? Doesn't your hand need to be on your chest, except when passing, landing or taking off? I'm not really clear on the rules (it's been a long time). Just curious.

The only fun for a CL racing pilot is getting away with all you can. Right-handers look like they're whippin', even when they're legal. Lefties can pull the plane all day and never get a warning.

In combat, when you have to run away from somebody inverted, being right-handed is a major advantage.

My clock has a dial you point toward the sun.
Didn't work very well in Seattle...

As for Coriolis forces, fugedaboutit: these are way too small to have a noticeable effect, even on full-scale aircarft, and especially on toilet flushes And, as an aside, in full-scale propeller aircraft, left turns (actually, rolls) are easier than those to the right because of propeller rotation and torque. In Europe, a fair number of engines turn the other way, and for them the easy direction is to the right.

I'd never thought about flying combat against an adversary set up to go clockwise upright. Launches would be a hoot to watch...

Kim Elmore

Kim Elmore

The reason I say this is when setting my body up to start a manuever, it's easier for me turn my body ahead of the plane and my right arm and get my body set first and then as the plane flys in front of me, my right arm which has been extend just to the right of the center of my chest, comes to the front of my body and I can start the manuever. If I fly cw and try this, I have to extend my right arm across and tight to my chest which inhibits motion. Works just the opposite for lefties so they should fly cw.

Just MHO.

Just a side comment - Gary "Rainman" Tultz can and does fly CCW and CW. But in order for him to do it, he has to fly CW with his left hand and CCW with his right. He's a right handed CCW flyer. Probably could put up a high 400 pattern with his left hand. I always knew he was wired different!

I am sure that the torque helping keep the model from wanting to roll in on the pilot had a lot to do with very early designs being configured to fly clockwise.

The first control line model I built was not a kit and called for the leadout cables (actual solid music wire) to be in the right wing and the model was to fly clockwise. I learn to fly that way, just as George Aldrich and others did. I had no problem until I started buying and building kits like the PDQ Flying Clown, Flying Circus, Veco Warrior, Squaw, Chief, Smoothie, Kenhi Bobcat, Wildcat, and Barnstormer. All of these called for counterclockwise flying direction.

I had no problem flying counterclockwise as long as I hooked-up the handle and lines so that down was up and up was down. Are you still with me? I seriously tried to change to up being up and down being down. After destroying a bunch of airplanes I gave up.

I was a bit embarrassed to let anyone know that I flew with down line being up and up line being down and I rarely revealed it to anyone.

Imagine how delighted I was when I first met George Aldrich and discovered that he flew the same way as I when he flew counterclockwise. I visited with him regularly during the 12 years I was stationed in San Antonio and I don't recall that he was left handed. But he might have been.

He did tell of the scarcity of kits when he was learning to fly and that most designs were for clockwise flying to take advantage of the torque in keeping the model from rolling in and for the old ingnition engines with tanks attached. Of course by the time inverted flying was routine the counterclockwise direction was established for competition in Stunt, Scale, Speed, Carrier, and Team Racing by AMA.

When we practiced, George and I both would fly the pattern in both counterclockwise and clockwise. Flying it clockwise required going inverted after takeoff.

We both could do the pattern backward, i.e., Start with the four-leaf clover entering it from the finish point by diving into the cloverleaf and doing the first outside loop of it, and so on, like drawing it backwards. Each maneuver was flown in backwards, and so on thru the reverse wingover.

The one thing I could never do: As a matter of routine, George would whip the his Nobler, with a dead engine, thru inside and outside consecutive loops, and lazy figure eights, then top it off with a perfect landing.

Jeff "Jeep" Newman, (deceased), is the only other Stunt Pilot that I ever saw do this.

I saw Jim Walker fly his three ignition Bantam .19 powered fireballs counterclockwise at three different contests. He had a handle in each hand and a handle mounted on what appeared to be a football helmet. He was a showman and he was ambidextrous. I also saw him fly the fireball with an Ignition Bantam 19 on his U-Reely, letting it out to 80+ feet and reeling it back to his hand. The Fireball never touched the ground. He also demonstrated his ever faithful RC lawnmower. It was an old fashioned reel type push mower. Fun to watch.

At the Tangerine Internationals in 1950 Jim came by the barracks at Pinecastle AFB in Orlando, where the contestants were staying. Combat was not an AMA event yet. He asked how many could get a "combat" model ready for a combat match. Seven of us rallied to his call.

The prize was to be one of his Firebaby models, complete with a spitfire .049 engine.

The rules were simple. At a signal everyone would start their engine and launch immediately. The last plane still flying would be the winner.

I had my mind made up as soon as I got airborn I was going inverted and right on the deck under all of them and pick my kill. The minute I went inverted all the other six models went splat, splat, splat! Since there was no rule against going inverted right away Jim gave me a Firebaby and disqualified me for the rematch, much to the delight of the other flyers. Going inverted would not be allowed for the rematch. The six remaining guys really put on a show too.

According to the laws of physics, "where there is a reaction there is an equal and opposite reaction.". The prop turns counter clock wise so that means the airplane is trying to rotate clock wise in the opposite direction. If you are standing in the center of the flying circle and the airplane rotates clock wise it will fly through the center of the circle which is not what you want. With the airplane trying to rotate clock wise it will be putting slack in the lines. I assume that is why we have, wing weight, fin off set, engine off set.

Personally I like flying counter clock wise it seems to be more natural. I am right handed and this makes me wonder if a left handed person feels more natural flying clock wise?

Right, but only when the moon is in the seventh phase, and Jupiter aligns with Mars!

I'm left handed (which is right) and I fly counter-clockwise right handed. Before the "safety thong" rule...I would change hands often while flying combat, it helped me win a few matches and confused some of the opponents, but it did have an alien feel, about the same as batting right handed. Tried a clockwise ship and had to fly it with my right hand and concentrate immensely. It's a right handed world.

"Left handed people are right."

BTW, I am a leftie flying the normal CCW. Seems like the best way to go. And, Bart also flies leftie CCW. I can only hope to do as well.