RAF Camouflage Colors - Source?

I'm building a profile Mosquito, and I want to get the paintwork right.

U.K. Dark Green, U.K. Ocean Grey, U.K. Medium Sea Grey; has any one mixed these from available butyrate dopes? (Brodak or Sig)

Any help or other ideas would be appreciated.

Mike,

sorry can't help with the colours, but what type of profile mossi is it? A frog? How about some details and pictures. The Frog design is on my "to do" list.

I'm building it from three views (Squadron/Signal "Mosquito in Action").
I scaled it so that I could buy wheels and spinners that are close to the right size. The span is roughly four feet. It will be pulled by a pair of .15's. The spinners have been partially filled with microballons/epoxy so that I can turn them to the right shape. The pushrod is actually a cable in the fuselage. I'm using a 3-line system for throttle.

Mike. I'm now going through the same exercise; trying to match RAF WW II camo and insignia colors.

Brodak sells a brown and an olive drab, which are pretty close. The O.D. is matte, but J. Brodak reports that a couple top coats of clear will make it glossy. For matte colors, you can mix talc in Brodak to take the shine away.

Sky blue is more difficult. I mix Brodak Insignia Blue and White.

The later version of the RAF wing roundels have just two colors, red and sort-of- purple (not blue). Purple is made from blue and red.

The white fuselage letters are off-white, and a tiny bit of black in the Insignia White will do it.

The folks who build plastic scale models have many colors to choose from, but they are enamels, and no good for U/C and glo fuel.

LAST EDITED ON May-15-06 AT 11:11 AM (CST)
 
>Mike. I'm now going through the same exercise; trying to
>match RAF WW II camo and insignia colors.
>
>Brodak sells a brown and an olive drab, which are pretty
>close. The O.D. is matte, but J. Brodak reports that a
>couple top coats of clear will make it glossy. For matte
>colors, you can mix talc in Brodak to take the shine away.
>
>Sky blue is more difficult. I mix Brodak Insignia Blue and
>White.
>
>The later version of the RAF wing roundels have just two
>colors, red and sort-of- purple (not blue). Purple is made
>from blue and red.
>
>The white fuselage letters are off-white, and a tiny bit of
>black in the Insignia White will do it.
>
>The folks who build plastic scale models have many colors to
>choose from, but they are enamels, and no good for U/C and
>glo fuel.
>
>Floyd

Chevron 'Perfect Paint' really was perfect for a camo color scheme. They made paint for all axis and allied schemes even to modern shades. Unfortunately the company is no longer in business but Brodak has quite a bit of it left. Incidentally this paint covers well and the camo dries really fast.
Dennis

edit, what else, spelling

http://www.warbirdcolors.com/ you may want to try this link to see if they have anything that you can use.

Chevron "Perfect Paint" comes in rattle cans. I think the request was for Brodak colors.

I only use rattle can paints for lawn furniture, and not model planes!

Beware changing brands/types of paints while painting a model You will only come to grief!

LAST EDITED ON May-15-06 AT 02:49 PM (CST)
 
>Chevron "Perfect Paint" comes in rattle cans. I think the
>request was for Brodak colors.
>
>I only use rattle can paints for lawn furniture, and not
>model planes!
>
>Beware changing brands/types of paints while painting a
>model You will only come to grief!
>
>Floyd

Floyd,
Perfect paint also comes in 4 oz cans., Both are priced in the catalogue. shame that it is getting hard to get. Nelson also will custom mix any color you need in his paint but it is pricey and his delivery is erratic. Klass Kote epoxy is also available in some camo colors and of course you will receive all the help you need from them in getting the shades that you need.

By the way Perfect paint goes over dope perfectly.It's very fuelproof but the camos really do benefit from their clearcoat which can be obtained in gloss or matt sheen.Really easy stuff to use and of course it goes on and looks well.....perfect.

Dennis

>By the way Perfect paint goes over dope perfectly.

Don't try it the other way, though.

(SNIP)
>
>The white fuselage letters are off-white, and a tiny bit of
>black in the Insignia White will do it.
>
>The folks who build plastic scale models have many colors to
>choose from, but they are enamels, and no good for U/C and
>glo fuel.
>
>Floyd

Anyone have any website sources for insignia clip art I can use to make decals? I am particularly interested in early WWII USAAC stars, stars and bars, Russian red stars, etc. used on P-39's

Thanks

I sell reproduced and custom decals.
http://billsdecals.com
I also have a Profile publication on the mosquito and can shoot you some examples of the colors.

Hi Bill,

Th link to the paint site is just the ticket. I did not know about this company. Thanks for the tip.

Do yo make custom size roundels?

>Hi Bill,
>
>Th link to the paint site is just the ticket. I did not know
>about this company. Thanks for the tip.
>
>Do yo make custom size roundels?
>
>Mike

Here are the missing letters: e u

M

>Hi Bill,
>
>Th link to the paint site is just the ticket. I did not know
>about this company. Thanks for the tip.
>
>Do yo make custom size roundels?
>
>Mike
Yes I do
Bill

You can get a nice booklet with proper colour chips from Frank Tiano Enterprises in Florida. He advertises in Flying Models and ships quickly.

The only other references I have for the British colurs are my trusty Harleyford book, Aircraft Camouflage and Markings 1907-1954, (1966) and I also have the Ducimus Camouflage and Markings booklet for the DH Mosquito, (1970).

I haven't mixed any real Britich colours yet, but used the Tiano booklet to check the USAAC mixes for my Mustang.

Hope this helps,

Ron King

For colors (colours), I am using the book WARPLANES & FIGHTERS OF WW II by Anderson, Gunston & Mason, published by Aerospace Pubs. Ltd. 1982, 2002; 179 Dalling Rd. Hammersmith, London.

Previous experience with Profile Publications indicates their colors are close, but not accurate enough for FAI scale work. Good enough for C/L semi-scale stunt.

Too bad those excellent Humbrol paints only come in the itty bitty cans...

>I'm building a profile Mosquito, and I want to get the
>paintwork right.
>
>U.K. Dark Green, U.K. Ocean Grey, U.K. Medium Sea Grey; has
>any one mixed these from available butyrate dopes? (Brodak
>or Sig)
>
>Any help or other ideas would be appreciated.
>
>Mike

Ron B.
F4Fguy

Mike:

A lot depends on how far you want to go. If you just want it to "look right" to the casual observer, you can get there by just mixing to an eyeball match with the "Squadron Signal" drawings. If you want documentable colors, the best source is IPMS. Even here though, you'll find that most foriegn colors are referenced to U.S. FS 595, or some other U.S. standard. In some cases these are very close, if not identical, but not always. In some cases as many as four or five "close" matches are given with notes such as "slightly greener" or "not as dense in hue". A good example is RAF "Sky Type S"' which is actually a greyed green, hence the nickname Duck egg.

IPMS Stockholm has published "Urban Fredriksson's Color Reference Charts" on the "WEB", They are probably the most extensive anywhere.If you once establish the color you want, the paint is as easy as throwing a few bucks at it. Just take the FS 595 or home mixed sample to your paint store and ask them to mix the pigmrnt for use in lacquer. This has the extra advantage of always being available for repairs etc.,just by referencing the original mix number.

In addition to color matching as such, Fredriksson also goes into techniques for compensating for "scale effect" and aging paint. All in all, a very interesting read even if you don't want to know that much for the model.

Mike,

On the Barton Club site, UK, ExRAFbod suggested checking with the RAF itself. He says they support aeromodelling, but beware abundant bumf, which he spells 'bumph' -- must be a Canuck, eh?

Link he offered, which I haven't yet tried, is:

www.raf.mod.uk/

Luck!

Interesting. Those RAF Eurofighters have the same squadron markings that they used on 1930s biplanes...

Isky,

Those are the squadron markings, and if the squadron remains on active service, why not use the traditional markings?

Not as gaudy as the 1930's 2'wide pattern strips on the upper wings of Hawker Fury bipes from roundel to roundel, but a nice touch of Brit traditionalism anyway.

BTW, I tried the site ExRAFBod passed along and was denied...?

LAST EDITED ON May-19-06 AT 07:54 AM (CST)
 
One of the most obvious mistakes frequently made in British camouflage was the use a a bright red on the National markings. After May of 1942, the red used in the upper, lower roundels and fin flashes was "Dull Red", something closer to maroon.

In general, the upper surface roundels were Dull Red and Blue only. This was a "B" roundel. The lower wing roundels were "C" type with a narrow White ring. The fuselage sides were generally "C1" which had a narrow White and Yellow rings. The fin Flash had a narrow White stripe with Dull Red forward on both sides of the aircraft.

In 1942, they got rid of the Brown camouflage and Sky bottoms, but kept the Dark Green. The paint schemes became Dark Green and Ocean Grey. Ocean Grey was similar to Dark Sea Grey. At this time the lower surface color was changed to Medium Sea Grey, as Sky was considered too bright at altitude. Fuselage bands, spinners and fuselage codes were Sky.

Personally, I'd find some photographs and mix my own colors. I did this on my Hornet. You don't have to bee too accurate on a semi-scale stunt or profile airplane.

LAST EDITED ON May-20-06 AT 00:52 AM (CST)
 
Yeah, the roundels changed over time (though I wasn't aware that they'd changed the red in the middle). Early (1939-1940) fuselage roundels had wide white and yellow bands, this was changed to narrow bands later on. The upper wing roundels, as far as I know, never had a white band (unless perhaps you go very far back before 1939). In the Pacific, they got rid of the red altogether, replacing it with white on the top.

I did a lot of looking at Spitfire and Hurricane photos the last few days, and made a few interesting discoveries. One was that the placement ans size of the roundel, the size of the squadron and aircraft code letters, and even the aircraft serial numbers, and the fonts used, varied from squadron to squadron.

Even the sequence for the code varied. On the left side of the plane (by far the more popular side portrayed!) the two letter squadron code was almost always to the left (i.e. in front) of the roundel, the one letter aircraft code in front of it:

On the other side, most pictures I've seen put the squadron code also to the left (behind) the roundel, the aircraft code in front.

(Mark II at Duxford - note non-standard yellow letters!)

But there are quite a few exceptions: