"POP CAN" SPIROD WINGS for Control line?"

Maaaaaaaaany years ago......while camping at a park near the bowels of Mt.St.Helens, before she blew the park away.

I watched with total amazement, some young kids flying "RAINIER BEER" aluminum beer cans, that their Boeing Aerodynamics Engineer father had made while he and his family and friends were sitting around the camp fire.

He had taken those beer cans...cut the top and bottom out. I noticed him adding a tiny piece of lead tape, to both sides of the top of the can...before handing it to his 3 young kids.
I was totally blown away to see, even his youngest son---perhaps only a little over 3 years old, as he took that can and "tossed it into the air." I can still see that look of pure joy and achievement on that little kids face, as he watched that "modified beer can float on and on, before it landed onto the surface of the lake...which appeared to be almost a half a football field length away from the campfire?
Was this a fluke. After his father corrected his son, for losing his toy into the lake, I watched his Dad, take another similar one and toss it down the beach. This can flew and floated on the calm night air...with the smoooooooooooooothest flowing flight that I can ever recall.
After talking with this young father, Kim Fernell, I had found that he had just left the Boeing Company, along with three other Aerodynamic Engineers...and formed a company called "AVAITION PARTNERS" soom after the Boeing company POO-POOED AND DEGRADED their new concept ideas about such non-sense as Blended wing technology, which Boeing thought, at that time...was just another wacky-idea, that at that time, was thought to be not only unbuildable, but not worth the extra $$$$ in fuel savings. Jet fuel in those early 60's and 70's was waaaaaaaaaay to cheap to justify the cost of manufacturing...etc.

Bottom line: HOW DOES THIS PERTAIN TO STUNT MODELS???
I still feel that we could also benefit from this techology, even though we fly a round circular flight path?
I worked as an artist-during the many many many tri-year Boeing Strikes, for Avaition Partners, and because of this, I had talked with Joe Clark, Bernie and Kim Fernell who were both aware at the time, that I flew model airplane and were curious if their blended wing concepts could help improve the flying characteristics of my toy airplanes on strings flight?

Then came up the cut-out beer can concept of SPIRODS?
This is certainly not new technology. In the Boeing archives...I had noticed concept drawings by many Boeing design groups, that were trying to harness that idea, not only on space craft, but also on underwater projects as well?

Hummmm? Any ideas...HEY GARY LETSINGER, PAUL WALKER, HOWARD RUSH, BOB PARKER...or any other of you Aero-Engineer types? Any possible ideas that this SPIROD concept could lend to our circle burner models, on strings that go round and round and round and round in endless circles????

Here y'are: http://www.aviationpartners.com/otherprograms/concepts.html#

How would you put flaps on them?

I just spent the last half hour or so trying to get a (root) beer can to fly. Would you please post a picture of the weight location and direction of flight?

I run across Kim Frinell every ten years or so. As I recall, he had flown some combat. I was going to get him out flying, but never did.

As I was flinging the can in the back yard, a 737 with Aviation Partners winglets flew over.

It's obvious why you are having problems getting it to fly... you have to use "Lite" Beer Cans!!!

It was diet root beer. Does that count?

As I recall from some of my mispent youth... Cut out the top of the alum can (after emptying..) leave the aluminum ring. Then cut the can to a length of app 2 3/8" varying this dimension will change the cg. Basically by shortening it the ring at the top will be the nose weight. Then throw like a football. The spin is necessary.. They will tend to hook a bit. Lots of cheap fun

Jim

Whammo, the Frisbee people used to make something called a "Turbo Tube". It was a 6" long piece of plastic tube with an airfoiled, raised edge at one end. It was made of heavy plasitc and you threw it like a football, spinning the tube. It would go a very long way.

Looks kinda like this:

Thanks, Howard for the link to Aviation Partners. In those early days when Joe Clark, Clay Lacy, Bernie Gratzer, Kim Fernell, were just getting started, they spent lot of hours playing with not only blended wing technolgy, but also were very much involved with other types of various wing tips. Some that actually changed angles and thickness, depending on flight speed and and direction of aloft wind patterns. Bernie had taken many many photos of hawks and birds of prey's wing tips, and also did numerous studies in slow motion movies trying to gain "out of the box" ideas pertaining to wing tip and winglet designs.

Like Howard Rush says: RaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaainierrrrBeer cans were the can of choice.

After a few brewski's, it is amazing how----just about ANYTHING FLIES.

Wow! The Turbo Tube of my boyhood! My brother and I wore our arms out with a series of these in the early 60's as I recall. They could be made to do lots of different flight paths and could fly 200 feet or thereabouts. Don't know why Wham-O stopped selling them, except maybe it hurt when they hit you in the head.

Full-scale aircraft were built on this principle as early as the 1920's and later by (who else?) the Germans during WWII. I believe even jet-powered versions were built but the practicalities of an aircraft of this shape outweighed the potential benefits. They live on as ducted fan aircraft in model and full scale, but don't use the duct as the lifting surface.

Say, isn't Wildwood near Seattle?

Yea, I spent many hours with friend "flying" the Turbo Tube. You can still get them from Burpgun.com. I couldn't resist ordering one when this topic came up and I remembered them.

>>Say, isn't Wildwood near Seattle?<<

Depends on how you catagoize "close". It's across the sound, southwest of Bremerton.

Randy Powell
Wildwood, Washington

Many years ago, on the 'idea-page', American Aircraft Modeler published a picture of someone's Ringmaster, no wing...just a pair of 26-oz. cans, like V8 juice: one on each side of the fuse. Stock tail group, bellcrank inside left can, bracketed thru fuse. Leadouts exited thru outer wall of left can. Was reported to fly fast, but not stunt. (!)

Mike in Atwater,
where a timid question will always receive a confident answer.

My first contest was the 1956 Mirror meet. I flew jr. novelty with a flying saucer. I did see someone that had a ringmaster it had a v8 can as wings. I did not see it fly but it was entered. I did come in 3rd. My first win. I got a can of spaghetti o's , a bottle of mr clean and a solid plastic F9F panther. What a feeling.

you can get plastic 2 liter bottles to fly as well as aluminum cans. turn a can or bottle sideways and look at the nice airfoilshape. the bottom has a nice curve cut the bottom of the can or bottle off leaving about 1/4 " of that curve. cut the top off so the sides are straight. you throw it bottom side forward like a football. you can use duct tape wrapped around the outside to add weight. the plastic ones fly best indoors.

FWIW - future reference...

This probably falls better in the category of "joined wings", or more specifically "annular" wings of the ducted variety, as opposed to annular plan-form variants. "Blended" usually is applied to fuselage/wing blending as in blended-wing-body (BWB) airliner configurations.

Surprisingly(?), while practically every configuration allowed by the technology of any time seems to have been tried, the only full sized annular winged aircraft I can think of now are those by Givaudan (tandem, 1909), D. Myers' "Orbitair" ultralight (ca. 1990-98), a Lockheed-Georgia transport study (ca. 1982), and ducted-fan annulars by SNECMA ('C-450' by Zborowski, et.al., 1950-59), L. Stipa (1930's, but had normal wings and tail too), and Lippisch ("aerodynes", 1956-60). Half-"cans" were built by Domingo, Custer, and others. There have been many annular acft. patents (especially with axial propulsion) and models. Not much CL stuff though, it seems.

There are a host of planar joined wings by Wolkovitch, Ratony, and others, that could be adapted to more cylindrical shapes with composites. I built a very small tandem annular model (DNF 20 years ago) with a nearly circular plan view and full-chord-staggered wings joined in a curve. It glided like a rock, but that was not due to the configuration.

I don't see why a simple cylindrical ducted model could not stunt as a sport model, especially if it shrouded a prop and elevator. Still a twin cylinder model with central fuselage and unshrouded prop would be fun. I'd like to build one with a bit more aspect ratio in the form of a highly staggered bipe with non-conventional flap/elevator set-up. I think annulars are great!

SK