High wings and T-tails...

I'm wondering because I recently re-discovered a WWII British dive-bomber called a Fairey Barracuda and thought it could make a pretty neat semi-scale-ish stunter. It had a huge wing, a liquid cooled V-12 with a chin mounted radiator that would make a great cowl, and that "cool-in-a-weird-sort-of-way" look of a WWII Royal Navy plane. It also had a T-tail... Would that cause any aerodynamic weirdness on a stunter? (My flying causes enough weirdness on my stunters, I don't need to add any more...)

Thanks!

God bless...

Not so for a CL Stunt Ship. We do not fly at the slow high angle of attack speeds that cause this problem. How do I know. I built one and have flown it in competition at the Brodak and Philly Phylers Contest. JOhn Sunderland has flown it and Windy Urtnowski videotaped it and both remarked on how well it flew. Go for the T-tail. Just make sure your linkages are linear and have minimal play.

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I think most of the full size aerobatic monoplanes out there are mid-wings, if not shoulder wings.

It has not always been so. The clipped wing Cub and Taylorcraft have done superb routines. Some great aerobatic aircraft have been "parasol" monoplanes; like the French Dewotine and the German FW-56 "Stosser".

The Barracuda was a TSR (Torpedo/Strike/Recon) aircraft rather than a dive bomber. It suffered from being underpowered, but nevertheless participated in a number of important actions in WW-2. The post war Mk V version had a Griffon engine and an enlarged fin/rudder assembly which might make it easier to hide any control linkage for the stab/elevator. The prototype 'Cuda had a conventional tail BTW, which was changed to the T type to cure a buffeting problem.
I always thought the Blackburn Firebrand would be a neat one to attempt also.
Dick Sarpolous had a Citibria (profile) Stunter published in FM a few years back.

I only have my tracings so far. I have started a construction article, but need to finish it. I will sit down this winter and do the plans and the rest. I will then give it to Tom Morris for SN. It is a semi-scale rendition of Darryl Greenamyer's F-104 Starfighter of the late 70s. I have always loved the Starfighter and Darryl's paint scheme was striking. Some numbers on it.

WS 53 inches
Avg Chord 11.5 inches
Elev to Flap hinge lines 14 inches
Flap line to CG 7 inches
CG to Wing LE 3 inches
LE to Spinner back plate 11 inches
Weight 52 oz
Engine OS 40 FP by Big Art
Airfoil Gieseke Nobler
The flap to elevator ratio is 2 to 3
I am running a Grish Tornado Black Magnum 3 Blade

It is take apart, the wing, horizontal tail and main gear are removable. I did an Al Rabe to get the fuselage profile and made a transparency and projected it on the wall and the plans of the Blue Box Gieseke Nobler to get the moments, engine placement, wing and tail correct.

In the future, I plan to do it again, but larger, 50 to 60 motor mounted sidewinder and full body.

I saw pics of your RB-104 on the Yahoo site and asked on that list but no-one seemed to have your number...

I saw the real bird up at Van Nuys airport before he crashed it. It was prettier in real life than in any picture.

God bless...

That's the puppy. You should see a photo of it with the wings folded...

"I want a Barracuda I can call my own,
A plane the RAF can never steal;
And all those whiskered P/O Prunes
With their Mossies and Typhoons
Will have to fly in aircraft that are real.'
As through the evening sky we slowly stagger;
A-waiting for the next poor chap to die;
I'd rather have a Barra I can call my own
Than have an aircraft that can really fly."

Attributed to Number 9 Naval Torpedo-Bomber-Reconnaissance Wing, sung to the popular wartime ditty "Paper Doll".

Ya gotta love it!

God bless...

Hi John,

I thought so too, and actually have started on the preliminary design work for a Firebrand, working out moments, etc.. I'm leaning toward the radial engined version (I think that was the major production version). There was a Rolls powered version too, but I don't know if those made into service or not.

Neat looking airplane, again, in a weird sort of way.

God bless...

Archie Adamisin had a Firebrand semi-scale in the early 70's. It was really a nice looking airplane. It flew pretty good also. Archie was a real competitor.

Keith

As for how it actually flew, I have no clue. But it was definitely an attractive ship.

L.

"I would give my right arm to be ambidextrous."

The only stunt design that I am familiar with that has been published with the name "Talon" was by Jim Kostecky in the Dec 66 issue of Flying models. It was a nice looking airplane (as were all of Kostecky's airplanes, with "conventional jet styling" and no T-tail. His Talon bears a lot of family resemblence to Kostecky's Formula S in Dec 68 Flying Models.

Jack Sheeks did publish his Knight in Jun 69 Flying Models. It was an I-beam, 35 powered, patterned after the Faulks Rivets Goodyear racer. The horizontal tail was mounted at the top of a very short vertical tail. In this context, it gives the appearance of a "T-tail". Because of the sloping aft end of the Knight/Rivets design, the horizontal tail on Jack's Rivets is actually only about one inch above the thrust line. Though this is higher than what is found on "more conventional designs" which will have the horizontal tail either very near the thrust line or as much as 1/2 inch to 3/4 inch above the thrust line. Because of the sloping fuselage, there was not much side area aft of the wing. It is a very neat looking airplane with cheek cowls and a fuselage mounted gear. According to the construction article, Jack "was very pleased with the performance of the ship." Jack also said that he was so pleased with it, he built a second ship.

The Little Mike semi-scale that Al made reference to was patterned after the Goodyear racer of that name. The full size Little Mike was originally built with a relatively high aspect ratio wing which I tried out on this ship. For those who might not remember the configuration of this Googyear racer, the horizontal tail was mounted on the vertical tail, well above the fuselage. On my model, the tail is 4 inches above the thrust line, the fully sheeted wing was on the thrust line. This was my venture into a high aspect ratio wing, short coupled exercise. It had a one-of-a-kind rear exhaust 40 (which is a long story) with a completely enclosed muffler. It was overweight, but for a while, the engine pulled it quite well. I do not recall that I had any particular problem with it turning insides any better or worse than outsides. Because of its weight, it liked to sink in the corners, particularly in the wind, just like any overweight stunt ship would do. It placed 10th at the 72 Nats. I had started a second one, but the Focke Wulf series I had took precedence. I do not yet have a way to post pictures on the forum. Maybe sometime in the future. There were pictures published in the magazines in the 72 time frame. I can give the issues if anybody is interested.

Keith

Send me your proofs of your various Stunt Ships from over the years, preferably in color, and I will scan them and then send them back to you via email.

You're right, I know what a Talon is (Jim Hoffman has a very competitive example) and that is NOT the ship I am thinking of.

I just HAD to look it up. Full sized plan MPS 179 from Flying Models, it is called the Knight. I can't seem to manage to see the FM issue date from my photocopy of the article.

This was back when Jack was cranking out a new model nearly monthly, as I recall.

If my rotten HP K80 scanner software hadn't croaked (after all, it HAD been re-installed for almost a whole week, and it IS a Windows environment!), I'd scan and post a photo.

Pardon my senior moment. (They're more frequent nowadays, guys.)

And Keith is absolutely right, it really isn't a true "T-tail",
but the aft fuselage styling pretends it is.

L.

"Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana."

I have an excellent British book written by an RN Captain who was a test pilot during WW-2. He flew all the carrier ac used by the RN at one point or another (including America types) and each chapter in the book is devoted to a different one. It has quite detailed ino on the history, etc. of each type, what it was like to fly, cockpit and internal details, photos, etc. Has chapters on both the Barracuda and the Firebrand. If it will help your project, I can copy the chapters for you and snail mail them, if you'll e-mail me your address.

I really appreciate your offer! The info would be very helpful. I'm having some trouble with your email address bouncing back though. would you drop me a note? [email protected]

Thanks!

God bless...