veco chief

i was wondering is anybody kitting the veco chief. i saw one at brodak in advance stunt and looked sharp. thinking i might like to buid one. thanks brad smith

Brad,
Try this site. His kits are hand cut and of the best quality.

http://www.builtrightflyright.net/LarryRichards/LarryRichards.htm

Will you have it done in time for the Tulsa contest?

>Brad,
>Try this site. His kits are hand cut and of the best
>quality.
>
>http://www.builtrightflyright.net/LarryRichards/LarryRichards.htm
>
>Will you have it done in time for the Tulsa contest?
>
>regards,
>Rick "catdaddy" Blankenship

Tony Cincotta (Saturn Hobbies) down in Oz does too, and the same high quality statement applies.
There are actually 4 Chiefs: The first Palmer designed "polywog" Chief, the second Wagner revised version- which is what most people are familar with as a Veco Chief, Wagner's "Super Chief" with a thicker airfoil and a few other changes which was never kitted, and the enlarged version of the Wagner 2nd model Chief which Tom Dixon did for .60 power in modern times...

>There are actually 4 Chiefs: The first Palmer designed
>"polywog" Chief, the second Wagner revised version- which is
>what most people are familar with as a Veco Chief, Wagner's
>"Super Chief" with a thicker airfoil and a few other changes
>which was never kitted, and the enlarged version of the
>Wagner 2nd model Chief which Tom Dixon did for .60 power in
>modern times...

John;

I just got back a set of Pat Johnston Chief plans that I sent to Bob Palmer. I remembered GMA mentioning that the ORIGINAL Chief did not have the pollywog airfoil. I asked Bob to annotate the plans and, if possible, from memory show the changes necessary to take it back to his ORIGINAL design.

Bob annotated the plans, to include the original airfoil. Pat's plans are quite close to what Bob originally had, and as those plans were based on an early kit, it appears that the major change from Bob's original and the kit was the pollywog airfoil.

Some people think the original kit pollywog airfoil adds something to the "essence" of the original Chief. Personally, it is a pain in the posterior to get silkspan to stick and stay stuck to the reflex curve in the ribs. If I ever build another, it will be with the Palmer original airfoil.

>
>>There are actually 4 Chiefs: The first Palmer designed
>>"polywog" Chief, the second Wagner revised version- which is
>>what most people are familar with as a Veco Chief, Wagner's
>>"Super Chief" with a thicker airfoil and a few other changes
>>which was never kitted, and the enlarged version of the
>>Wagner 2nd model Chief which Tom Dixon did for .60 power in
>>modern times...
>
>John;
>
>I just got back a set of Pat Johnston Chief plans that I
>sent to Bob Palmer. I remembered GMA mentioning that the
>ORIGINAL Chief did not have the pollywog airfoil. I asked
>Bob to annotate the plans and, if possible, from memory show
>the changes necessary to take it back to his ORIGINAL
>design.
>
>Bob annotated the plans, to include the original airfoil.
>Pat's plans are quite close to what Bob originally had, and
>as those plans were based on an early kit, it appears that
>the major change from Bob's original and the kit was the
>pollywog airfoil.
>
>Some people think the original kit pollywog airfoil adds
>something to the "essence" of the original Chief.
>Personally, it is a pain in the posterior to get silkspan to
>stick and stay stuck to the reflex curve in the ribs. If I
>ever build another, it will be with the Palmer original

>airfoil.
>
>Bob

Bob: and you are absolutely correct, in all respects. From what I understand, the ONLY reason (per Bob Palmer himself) they went with the polywog on the kit was so as to not have to machine a tapered TE.

John you are right. I asked Bob at VSC 13, as I have a 1949 Henry Engineering kit of the chief. Brwon corrugated box with a white label printed in red. The pollywog ribs line up with the trailing edge, which is straight, not tapered. The plans by Pat Johnson are 99% accurate. The differences I found by checking with my kit pieces were very minor; a 1/16" here and there and 1/8" in the rudder/fin height. That can be accoutned for in the swelling of the wood in a kit that is 51 plus years old. Not worth worrying about, but I just had to mention it, knowing me as I do.

As I recall (per GMA) Bob flew the original type Chief you are talking about at the '48 Olathe NATs. Power was a McCoy .29 rear intake. Shortly afterwards, he went to the Fox.

Brad I saw a Chief fly this past weekend at the FM Skylarks annual contest in Fargo ND. It had an OS 40 Surpass for power and it flew as if was on rails. I was very impressed with this aircrafts performance and the 4 cycle engine really contributed to the impression points. I'd say go for it.

Joe Wagner is still alive and kicking, and drawing up a storm. I know he has re-drawn the Chief and Super-Chief, as I have a set of his plans!

Contact him at [email protected]

I have a mint NIB Veco Chief that one day I will copy and build.It is such a visually appealing plane and as metioned above a great flyer.Wish you the best on your Chief project.Dennis

Hello All

I am on my second Chief, both with the poly wing. As we apply bonas points here in VS my have the original long undercarrage which can be difficult to land. I find that when slowed down to land, we mostly fly on grass, it can stall and bounce.

Many coats of dope on the ribs and the reflex wing is easy to cover. Glue the tissue or silk (what I use) to the ribs and it will stick for ever.

I like the CHIEF and in calm air it is a delite to fly. Thjough it can be tricky inverted with the decalarge in the tail.

I woudl liek to try one with a "Saftig" wing section, short UC and spinner which is the later DUMAS kit( date unknown ) I think it would be great to fly.

John Quigley

>Hello All
>
>I am on my second Chief, both with the poly wing. As we
>apply bonas points here in VS my have the original long
>undercarrage which can be difficult to land. I find that
>when slowed down to land, we mostly fly on grass, it can
>stall and bounce.
>
>Many coats of dope on the ribs and the reflex wing is easy
>to cover. Glue the tissue or silk (what I use) to the ribs
>and it will stick for ever.
>
>I like the CHIEF and in calm air it is a delite to fly.
>Thjough it can be tricky inverted with the decalarge in the
>tail.
>
>I woudl liek to try one with a "Saftig" wing section, short
>UC and spinner which is the later DUMAS kit( date unknown )
>I think it would be great to fly.

Rub several coats of cement into the rib edges until you get a nice shine, it will stick forever when covered. It's just a pain to (old FF trick) do. I got this from GMA.
Dumas kit is just a carryover of the Veco Wagner 2nd model Chief. As an aside, Joe stated main reason Gil Henry wouldn't kit his "Super Chief" was because the thicker airfoil used up more balsa sheets for the same
number of wing ribs.

The Chief is a very striking classic for sure. Here is my previously posted 2nd version built from plans. It does have a total wingspan of some 56" due to a building error and wing construction changed somewhat, though airfoil remains the same or very close.
Initial engine was an OS 40FP and initial weight was 41-42 oz. It definitely has more authority with the currently in place LA 46. Perhaps 1 to 1.5 oz of tailweight have been added so the total weight is now probably around 46-46 though I have not weighed it.
After a lot of debugging including the addition of an outboard trim tab, it's now a pretty decent airplane. The extra power of the .46 LA is what got it to where it is IMO. Still needs some more tweaking of leadouts, more tail weight, and handle spacing for better hard inside corners. Outside corners are very good.

>Joe Wagner is still alive and kicking, and drawing up a
>storm. I know he has re-drawn the Chief and Super-Chief, as
>I have a set of his plans!
>
>Contact him at [email protected]
>
>Larry

I tried this address and the E-Mail was returned as not deliverable. Anyone got a later address for Joe?
Steve

>> (...)
>>
>>Contact him at [email protected]
>>
HMMMM? I think there is an extra "E" in that!
>
>I tried this address and the E-Mail was returned as not
>deliverable. Anyone got a later address for Joe?
>
Try this instead! [email protected]

.
Kiwi

Joe writes for Model Aviation, I think his current info will be in the header for his column. It is in every other month, as I recall.

Sorry for the bum address, I haven't been in contact with him for a while