Akromaster vs Jr Flite Streak (SIG vs Brodak)

Well, I'll do my part to help the board get to 10,000 post by the end of the year.

I just completed an Akromaster, it's ready to paint. The kit was a joy to build, everything was straight, nice wood. I'm not real crazy about the nylon bellcrank in the kit, but we'll see how it works out. I have a second Akromaster to build but when I opened it, the LE and TE for both wings we badly warped, as was the fuse. Rather than waiting to straighten them out, I decided to build the Brodak Jr Flite Streak instead. (Both planes are for my kids).
I thought the SIG kit was nice, until I got into the Brodak kit.
Plans and directions are terrific, wood is great, hardware package complete and the nylon bellcrank is much nicer, heavier duty.
I'd say the Akromaster wing was easier to build, given straight parts, of course, but overall the Brodak kit, so far, seems to be a clear winner in terms of overall quality.

The Akromaster is getting an old Enya 19, 4004 model, I think?
It cleaned up nicely after being packed away for 20 years. I've got an 8-6 prop, and an 8-5 3 blade. Which would be better suited for this engine? What about a 9-4 cut down to 8-4?

Jr Streak is getting a NIB, Fox 15 slant plug, per Currell's suggestion. Would the cut down 8-4 be o.k. for this or would a 7" prop be better> I've never run anything smaller than a 19 before, so I'm not sure about prop sizes for these.

I tried several props for my slant plug 15 on my Akromaster. It definitely likes an 8-4 best. I tried an r/c master airsc*&(*w, and the Grish Tornado magnum, but best performance and tension is with the current APC 8-4.

I ran an Enya .19 for a while on a jr ringmaster and it liked the 9-4 or 9-5 cut a half inch to 8.5. but these were master airsc)#()w. never really got to test the other prop types. THis engine might run really well with one of the Tornado's since the blades are a bit wider.

The Enya might take a long time to break in completely.

And 15% fuel made a world of difference over 10% in the Fox.

The Enya liked 10% ok. both 20-25% castor though...NOT the synthetic lube R/C Fuel..THis was probably the single biggest change I made early that improved my (success??) with these engines.

FWIW,

Save the 8-6's for "speed runs" with the Enya (calm days, 60' by .012's, maybe). Try more than one brand of 9-4 first. Most 19's ran with 9-4's better than almost anything else. Same with most 15's of the older type design, if the first 8-4 isn't quite the one yours likes, try another brand until you do find the right one it likes best.

Trying one of those black composition paint stirring sticks from Canada does not count as trying a real prop.

"Trying one of those black composition paint stirring sticks from Canada does not count as trying a real prop. Kiwi"

I figure Kiwi must mean the "Dreaded Master Airscr*w" props. Why blame the Canadians for something that comes from California, not that far from where APC's are made? Was it the "Windsor" that threw you off, Kiwi, or did your (grey) computer crash again? A year or two ago, Windsor/Master Airscrew said that they were revising their standard line of props, with improved airfoils. Does anybody know how to tell the difference between old and "improved"? Has anybody tried the new variety to see if they really are better?

The Fox .15 or .15X is a perfect match for either model. An 8-4 will suit it well, but the X may like it trimmed to 7.5". The Tornado props are a good value and work. They make white ones that are flexible and tough, and black ones that are stiffer and more fragile but better performance. Avoid 3 blade props unless the model is truly overpowered, and stick with 4" pitch for the .15 and .19.

I found it interesting that at the fab "Bladder Grabber" combat contest last weekend, that contestants used an amazing variety of props. APC, Master Airscrew "Scimitar", Bolly Clubmen, reworked wood props (I think they were Zinger "pile-ons" and Rev Ups), Taipan cuffed root type (orange ones) and unidentified epoxy/ carbon/glass. All went well. This is a very serious contest, $50 entry, with over $15k worth of prizes, and contestants from all over the country. They would use the props that worked best, no doubt in my mind. There were several empty model boxes to dispose of. Howard lost one model with Nelson .36 O.O.S., as the Free Flight guys say. Shutoffs don't always work after a midair. Steve

A regular 8-4 for the Fox Slant Plug. A 9-4 for the Enya .19. On windy days, try an 8-6. 15% nitro for the Fox, and at least 10% for the Enya. Currell

Timme6,

Contact Sig about the warped parts. They can probably send new ones.

An Enya .19 is a lot of power for an Acromaster. I have one on a Ukey 15, (which is a larger, heavier airplane than the Acromaster) & it's overpowered. Even running 5% nitro 29% castor Powermaster fuel it flys like a slow combat plane. If you're looking for a hotrod it will be fine, if you're a beginner you might want to go with something a little tamer in the nose.
Nils

The only Enya I have experience with was a 29. Weighed about 8 Ounces, looked attractive, came with two heads and three black plastic venturi inserts. But I thought that I recalled a quite small Enya 19, at least compared to the 29. I guess that was what my mental picture of Timme's choice for the Akromaster might be.

But most 19's would be rather heavy, and probably over-powerful for what the design's structure was intended to handle, rather like using a modern 15 in the Akro. Let's ask Currell. He likes Enyas, I believe. "Is that '4004' the "little Enya" with the teardrop exhaust that has about the same kind of power as the 15's that the Akro is intended for?"

The K.

The 4004 is what I have on the Ukey 15. It has a regular oval shaped exhaust with dimples where you can drill & tap for a muffler. I'm not familiar with the teardrop shaped exhaust Enya .19's. I have two & both of mine are 4004's.
Nils

Just for the record:

The "Teardrop" .19 is 4002.

The "Teardrop" .29 is 5002.

Yeah, I like Enyas, although most of my flying is with brand F, McCoys, OS, the odd Greenhead, occasional Johnsons, etc.

Never saw a worn out swap Enya. Never.

Just curious. How old are your kids that you are building the planes for? How come they aren't building them? Hmmm? Sounds like me in 1976 when I got a "train set" for my 5 year old son. Son, ha, it was for me,me,me. So, are they helping to build what they will be flying and crashing? Nice guilt trip, eh.

Just for the record-your probably one of hundreds of Fathers out there "building it for the kids". Nothing wrong with that-if it keeps you interested in doing something with the kids! After all aren't we all just kids in man's bodies? If it means spending time with your kids-go for it, Some kids don't have the patience to build a plane but like to spend the time flying with their fathers. Later on as they get older they'll learn from example and probably want to build themselves. By the way I agree the Akra kit left someting to be desired by way of instructions and the few Brodak planes I have built are excellent in quality.

BB,

My kids are a girl, 10 and boy 7. They live with their mom, and help to work on the planes when they are at my house. In the interest of getting them built to fly before summer is over, I spend a couple hours of my evenings working on them.
We painted the Akromaster this weekend. "We" as in, they painted and I repainted. It may be a trainer and it's lifespan may be short but I still want it to look half decent.
My son has more interest in the building than my daughter does, and he likes putting things together and gluing them. He can't wait to paint the Jr Flite Streak.
The Enya 19 on the Akro is a little over 20 years old, and is well worn. My brother and I had it on an R/C plane that we had back around 1980 or so, and it had plenty of flight time screaming at full throttle. Although, after I cleaned it up, it seemed to run o.k. on the test stand. Like Currell said, he never saw a worn out Enya.
Got the Akro completely ready to go last night, tank, tubing lead-out ends etc. Balances at the first lead-out, about 1 1/4 "
from the LE with the Enya set all the way back in the mounting cutout, and no tail or nose weight added. Haven't weight it, but I'd say it's not light, but not a pig either. Used the Skyloft covering, took 5 coats of clear to seal and then 3 color coats on the plane. Add in a couple coats of sealer and I'd say the airframe weight probably doubled after covering and painting.
The skyloft covering seemed to work o.k. Not real crazy about the way the wing tips turned out, but the next one will be better, I hope.
Thanks for the help and comments guys,
Tim