Epoxy paint for stunters

I used to paint my stunt ships with Hobbypoxy and Superpoxy. I still do and have slowly been using up the Superpoxy remains of my friends. Most of my remaining clear and hardener are, to some extent, turning orange. I have compatibility or fuel contamination problems with dope and auto finishes, so have been limping toward exhaustion of remaining Superpoxy.

Yesterday, Frank McMillan called me to point out an advertisement on page 107 of Model Aviation Jan issue advertising Klassloat epoxy paint system. I talked to Nate Dickerson at Klasskoat. It sounds like it would be risky to try to mix paints, hardeners and thinners with Superpoxy but probably safe to use Klassskoat and Superpoxy together as long as their components aren't mixed. Snaggletooth will be painted with Superpoxy colors and Klasskoat clear. If that works well, I will begin to phase in Klasskoat colors to replace my dwindling supply of Superpoxy.

If you miss Hobbypoxy and Superpoxy this may be a comparable substitute.

I saw the add also. I am going to bookmark their website. As a result of the Simi Valley,CA fires, my lungs are killing me and I am going to try something different then the usual. Godzilla's paint method is also high on the list.

One of our club members, Ken Kaiser, has been using Klasskote, and is very enthusiastic. He is even painting the wings and tails of his FF models with it. Says it sprays well, and the clear, used as a topcoat over Nitrate dope is an extremely light finish. BTW, he double covers with Japanese tissue over Polyspan, a very few coats of dope, and then the epoxy. Tough as nails, and the tissue adds less weight than dope and primer would to get an equivalent finish.

It looked slightly textured, but high gloss. But then he didn't do any sanding. I'll bet that a hit with 600 grit before that topcoat would really improve the shine.

Any contact information on Klasskoat? Website?

I used Hobbypoxy way back when and found it impervious to fuel, could even brush it on. When applied over a single coat of polyester resin the combo made a slick surface that hid grain better than 20 sanded dope coats. Longevity? My 25 year old powder blue buster shows no surface cracks, still true in color. Went on a scouting mission to find an equivalent. Petit says never again... Actually testy. They make two part paints for boats. Seems like the automotive paint alternative. So, what of Klasskoat (sounds like a radical anarchist company, those substituted ks for cs-- Amerika, Kulture).

Go to www.klasskote.com They have a color chart there and test results by Dave Platt.

It says it's for R/C models. Too bad, it sounded promising. Has anybody tried the water based stuff from Gerry Nelson in Hillsboro, Oregon????? With the catalyst, it's supposed to be good with hot fuel. I could look for them again at the NW Model Expo. It kinda reminded me of poster paint in the jar...kinda chalky. Repair is an issue with all non-dope products, IMHO. Steve

LAST EDITED ON Dec-02-03 AT 11:04 PM (CST)
 
38 years of testing.. and we hadn't heard about it? ^_^;;; Makes you wonder what else there is out there that we don't know about. I wish I were still in the US - I'd give it a try.

Basic ugly color choice. Is the depth and color quality of Brodak dope an illusion? The Bro insignia blue and fokker red looks somehow subtle on my streak. Could use the clear coat as a final sealer, after dope gases off. Then there is the repairs. But as a no fuss no muss paint it, abuse it, wash it when the mood hits-- Epoxy was great stuff back then.

What about that Nelson paint? It's been mentioned a number of times. Anyone tried the miracle pigment applied by sponge brush? (On the website they mention that as a possible application technique.) Hobby Poxy (but not Superpoxy) could be brushed on after the surface was tacked. Smooth even coat after set up.

Repairs over epoxy are no problem, unlike over Urethane. Dope goes over epoxy just fine, and vice-versa. You might want to sand the surface a bit where you are doping.

Urethane will go over dope just fine, but I am pretty sure that putting dope back over Urethane will make it do evil things.

I have done any number of Major repairs to epoxy airplanes which is to say Hobbypoxy. It sands well and refinishes without problems. I used it over dope and had dope mixed in the repairs. I am still painting with epoxy after trying the newer dope and auto finish materials.

Hi Al,
How would you compare the weight of the epoxy finishes to a comparable level of finish using the other systems?
I know you keep up with that data.
Thanks
Bill

Any thoughts (or experience) on mixing jazzy or subtle colors from the basic ordinary epoxy paint offerings? Every time I look at Bob Zambelli's Nobler, I think man what a neat color he mixed. But that was dope.

LAST EDITED ON Dec-06-03 AT 11:35 AM (CST)
 
With Red, Green, Blue and White you can make any color you heart desires.

Well almost, can't make the metalics, silver, gold.....

Ahh yes, RGB like color tv. But some of us have a better eye. How about a little discussion of color mixing. Colors people dug when they customized. Also, is it that simple? Am I deceiving myself but it looks to me like the color qualities of some paints, dopes, etc. are more subtle than others. Isn't there a gap between rustoleum bright red and a Brodak complicated dope mix? Many of us have seen neat schemes that include great color values on stunt ships. Yes? No?

Also I think it is possible to mix metal flakes into epoxy. Anyone done that. I know it's commonly done with dope.

I have a part can of Hobby Poxy Custom Metalizer purchased from my LHS that I used several times successfully with Super Poxy and Hobby Poxy a few years ago. It workes very nicely with the blues but with the reds there was too much color change to enjoy the results. The only red metalic I could come up with was rather dark and had no zip. This was not dry metal flake but was a rather viscous mixture compatible with the colors of epoxy paint. The amount you needed was a product of trial and error. Now I believe that the two brands mentioned may be out of business because of regulations from the EPA. Bummer. Keith Varley

Keith Varley

When building semi-scale, I routinely mixed Hobbypoxy colors like the Sea Grey and Sky on the sea Fury and the particular rust color used on the top wing roundels only on WW2 British aircraft.

Epoxy probably weighs a bit more than dope finishes, particularly since I didn't rub them out, but the weight penalty of perhaps 10% was gladly accepted for durability of finish. Snaggletooth is thirty years and 2200 flights old, and still ready to go (if the tank hasn't rusted).

Color mixing isn't quite THAT simple, sadly. Pigments don't mix like light and pure colors should. You tend to get muddy or gray colors when you try to get, say orange from red and yellow.

Tinting one color to bias it a bit toward another will work fine, adding white to make a pale color will work too. Black may go toward green, blue or brown as you add it to other colors. Experiment with small batches, and then let it dry to see the true result. BE AFRAID, BE VERY AFRAID!

Definitely don't mix something you think ought to work and spray your new pride and joy!

>Color mixing isn't quite THAT simple, sadly. Pigments don't
>mix like light and pure colors should. You tend to get
>muddy or gray colors when you try to get, say orange from
>red and yellow.
>
>Tinting one color to bias it a bit toward another will work
>fine, adding white to make a pale color will work too.
>Black may go toward green, blue or brown as you add it to
>other colors. Experiment with small batches, and then let
>it dry to see the true result. BE AFRAID, BE VERY AFRAID!
>
>Definitely don't mix something you think ought to work and
>spray your new pride and joy!

Larry,

Well said. The problem with trying to mix new colors from a manufacturer's existing colors is that each one of the mixed colors is made up of toners which are pure pigments for each of the base mixing colors. The combination of the toners, done properly, can make up, say, a beautiful "jump out at you" red.

However, when you try to tint this great red to another color by using another already mixed color the combination of base pigments in the colors may give quite different results due to the interaction of base pigments. The result may well be, as you said, muddy, gray, or washed out colors. There are exceptions as we have all had some degree of success at mixing/tinting colors from existing manufacturer's colors but it isn't usually the rule.

Metallics are made by using translucent color toners which allow the metallic effect to show through the color. Successfully tinting metallics is difficult and tends to result in washed out colors.