dizzy newbie

I mentioned some of this same stuff over at RC Universe before I could get in here, but there seem to be more people here.

I have been practicing spinning around while watching my hand instead of the wall, but I always get dizzy by the time a minute comes up. I do about 3 or 4 second "laps" that way. Perhaps there's another way to get used to this before I have to crash?

The plane I just built is a 1/2A Deweybird, with a muffled Cox I found in the trash some years ago attached to one of those icky plastic planes. Looks like it will be just under 5 oz. I wonder if this will do loops and eights or if I'm doomed to depositing lunch on my shoes and my plane nose first into the ground.

Of course it may turn out that I can't make the Cox run and then I'll either have to get one of those Norvell things or build a larger plane for my OS .10 (after finishing all the outstanding rc and ff projects, after all, I'm just a newbie who knows no better).

It's best to try this outside, and just hope no one sees you. Watch the background, not your hand. The .049's are supposed to be the universal "beginners" engine/plane size, but most on here will say to try to get started with at least a .15/.19 size plane. Laps are a little slower and the planes fly, not hang on the prop. Many, many have been given a plastic thing that looked like a scale model with the .049 in them and they very seldom truly fly and many end up in the trash like the one you found. I tried to start my three kids on them and but they ended up building and flying their own Flite Streak trainers, the solid wood wing version, powerd with .15 engines and they all preferred it and learned much quicker and stayed with it longer. None like the "little" planes. We adults used the .049 engines for Mouse Race, 1/2A Good Year, etc. Just a thought.

>>>It's best to try this outside, and just hope no one sees you. <<<

Just go to the middle of a large metropolitan area. No one will notice you.

This months issue (Jan '04) Flying Models magazine has a great little trainer plane that will utilize the .10 engine very well. You might be able to scale the plans in the magazine or there are ordering instructions to get the full size plans. If you build one and fly it 'till your bored with it and ready to step up to the next level, you will have neat little plane to pass on to the next "newbie" on the block...

LAST EDITED ON Dec-29-03 AT 03:54 AM (CDT)
 
Lincoln,

Ty's technique works best for me. Pick out six or eight points around the circle in the background on which to focus. Let the plane fly through your field of view, move to the next point snd repeat. This allows your eyes to avoid seeing that blur of a background which is what makes me dizzy. Some folks have the opposite reaction.

With the right power, the Deweybird should be able to do large, open loops and eights. If you don't have lines yet, I'd recommend a set of .008"×35' braided cables. This is the minimum length I'd use, and if I could find 42' lines, that would be preferable.

This should answer your questions. When YOU are ready to move to a larger plane/engine combo, you'll find that the same technique works there as well.

By the time you are ready to fly some simple maneuvers, you'll want to watch the plane fly through the maneuver and when it returns to level flight, you'll find that you become a lot less dizzy even though you will tend to follow the plane rather than scan the background.

Even when I had my first flight a couple of years ago I didn't have to much of a problem with dizziness - even though I was 47.

I looked at the plane and ignored the background.

I did (do?) tend to wander a lot though!

Tony

LAST EDITED ON Dec-29-03 AT 11:26 AM (CDT)
 
Fellows--While we are on the "dizzy" thing. I have kind of asked this before--What about age? I'm 65, and because I don't have some one to fly with all the time I don't get too much flying in anymore. Granted, flying is like riding a bike--you don't forget,well!!! What I am asking is, IF, I get out there and get some flights in, will this dizzy thing go away. Are some of you "older" fellows having a similar problem?
PS--How did you get your "post" numbers back???

Yep the more you fly the less dizzy you will get. When I came back after 20 years off, was a little dizzy on my first flight but after that I was fine.

After my first CL flight after 20+ years, I fell flat on my backside, much to the amusement of my wife. She said, "Yep, that looks like a fun hobby, all right!" I still get a little dizzy on occasion, and then I let the plane fly level and look at a fixed point for a half lap or so, or do more maneuvers to change the perspective. Still working on those basic maneuvers.

What works for me is to focus on the model, ignoring the background.

I can get dizzy a little when inverted, since I suppose it is because it is not the usual direction.

OK, Thanks fellows--your input give's me encouragement -- Go out there and "burn up some sky"!!!
Like I told one fellow, I have to many planes to build (80 #'s of plans) a good wife to love and More miles on the trail,backpacking!!!
Dave Shrum:) (just couldn't help it)

Learn how to do Lazy 8's whenever you get dizzy just start doing them until it goes away. By stretching them out you start learning inverted flight.

Dave, I don't think age per se has much to do with it, but your state of health. The larger the plane and there fore the longer the lines, it is easier for me to watch the plane. After all that's what we are flying, not the back ground. But if the speed is high enough for 4 second laps, I do get a little dizziness and have to look at the background and let the plane fly to that spot, shift ahead, etc. I don't dare do any loops or figure eights as the plane speeds up, due to it running out of fuel and the engine going lean. This usually takes two to four laps. But I have had it go lean for 6 minutes. I'm 63 and get dizzy quicker than when I was 19, that's a given.
The only way to tell is go fly. If you start with 1/2A planes on 35 to 45 foot lines, you may get dizzy quite quickly. However, with 54 to 60+ lines, this should not occur unless the plane is making fast laps at the 4 second + area. Most PA is done at the 5 to 5.5 seconds per lap. This of course will vary with the individual and is not a rule. During maneuvers of course we stay in one spot and no dizziness unless putting your head back and looking straight up causes one to get unbalanced or dizzy such as during wing overs or over head eights. Only was to know is to fly.

"This allows your eyes to
>avoid seeing that blur of a background which is what makes
>me dizzy."
I shot some video at Topeka this year where they have a lot of trees near the circles. Just watching the video where it's zoomed in on the planes with all of the trees zipping through the background will make you queezy.

>With the right power, the Deweybird should be able to do
>large, open loops and eights. If you don't have
>lines yet, I'd recommend a set of .008"×35' braided cables.
>This is the minimum length I'd use, and if I could find 42'
>lines, that would be preferable.

Lincoln:
I would definitely recommend using 42' lines. A number of years ago I used a couple of Deweybirds to teach my kids how to fly. The planes were much too fast with 35' lines.
By the way, I found the Deweybird to be very suitable for a primary trainer. It was quite resistant to the crashes that one would expect to have when teaching complete novices and easy to repair in those rare instances when there is some crash damage. Until you get the hang of it, keep it nose heavy (that's not difficult) and use minimal elevator throw. And, yes, with the elevator throw increased and a little tail weight it will do loops and lazy eights when you are ready.
Perhaps it is not as stable as a larger model, but it will work and you can have a ball with it. Enjoy!

>I mentioned some of this same stuff over at RC Universe
>before I could get in here, but there seem to be more people
>here.
>
>I have been practicing spinning around while watching my
>hand instead of the wall, but I always get dizzy by the time
>a minute comes up. I do about 3 or 4 second "laps" that way.
>Perhaps there's another way to get used to this before I
>have to crash?

Maybe, but you'll get used to it. Almost certainly, you will crash a few times for reasons aside from getting dizzy. I would add that simply spinning around with nothing to do or follow makes me slightly dizzy, too. But I never have much of a problem with it when flying. Just watch the airplane.

My opinion is that the only cure for dizziness while flying is to simply fly some more.

This is way outside my area of expertise, but I think what is happening is that new flyers with new models, experienced flyers with new models, experienced flyers with new and/or old models but with no recent flying, all tend to fixate on the model when flying. There is a huge disparity in the degree of fixation with the first example being the worst case.

As all attention is being placed upon the model the background just goes into a big blur and this causes dizziness.

As one gets more and more comfortable with the model less and less concentration is required and so one's field of view opens up to the point where there is little apparent motion in the background.

Ty's suggestion to pick points around the circle upon which to focus is a good one. Someday I hope to find a new CL flier who appears able to handle yet another suggested action during flight and test out the theory.

I just spend time with Dirt, Paul, Chris, Alice, and Dave and the other Dave, Dave , Dave and David .........See what I meen!

If you do circles put your arm out in front of you so you get used to your arm in front of you.

Scott(not dobbie gray)Riese

>I just spend time with Dirt, Paul, Chris, Alice, and Dave
>and the other Dave, Dave , Dave and David .........See what
>I meen!
>
>If you do circles put your arm out in front of you so you
>get used to your arm in front of you.
>
>Scott(not dobbie gray)Riese

By the same token, if you don't do "circles," put your arm in back of you so you get used to your arm in back of you.

Dan (No, I don't see what you mean!) Rutherford

SEE what I meen

Scott (Not Tommy Row)Riese

Get yourself a long stick, bamboo or whatever, and fasten a small model airplane onto the end. Go outside and start doing 6 second laps, then work your way down to 5 second and maybe even 4 second. If this doesn't help, use the long stick to whack Scott. Or Dan. Steve

>Get yourself a long stick, bamboo or whatever, and fasten a
>small model airplane onto the end. Go outside and start
>doing 6 second laps, then work your way down to 5 second and
>maybe even 4 second. If this doesn't help, use the long
>stick to whack Scott. Or Dan. Steve
>
>http://www.nwskyraiders.com/index.html

Have you seen my trainning tool STEVE. The Rods with the handle? It works.

Scott()Riese

you can also try the "ironman" technique. Ignore the spinning sensation from you ears and focus on what your eyes are telling you. You can learn to ignore the whirling sensation from you inner ear.

For a variety of reasons some people are more subject to vertigo. You might check with your doctor, esp. if you are taking any medications. Dizziness can be a side effect of a lot of meds. Dizziness is one problem with CL flying. Some people simply can't overcome dizziness.

I got dizzy today, first time I was up in the air with another guy on our Class II Goodyears. I did launch for him and the other guy a couple times, then I had to try it. We're all newbies to it. Well the other guy was there going around essentially turning on his heels and I got out to the center of the circle after a 15 yard dash and ended up running around as fast as I could in a 3 foot diameter circle once every 3 seconds..

I don't know how many laps I made, but I told the other guy I wasn't gonna make it and managed to land it in flat as I was falling down. Rolled over and laughed while the world stopped spinning.

We worked it out, to more of a pivot between the both of us and I made it through the next flight, but I am tired and sore now. I need a good meal and someone stroking my ego before I get back up on step.

It were fun. Class I goes faster than this, so it must be possible, but I don't know how.

Just do as I do! Put one foot on the floor!
Oh that's an entirely different kind of spinning!
Steven Adler