Pattern Stunt Ship

LAST EDITED ON Feb-10-04 AT 08:24 PM (CDT)
 
I have teamed up with some RC guys who own a company that makes highly competitive RC Pattern ARF's. We exchanged some information and a few CAD files and Poof! A new design.

[photo not recovered: 402968fb61480e9f.jpg]
Their web site

www.aeroslave.com

Hi

It's a little difficult to tell but it looks like you got the CG a long way behind the leadout wire. Am I misinterpreting your plan?

I don't think with the nose to tail relationship that it is too far back. Dennis

The wing has a large LE sweep effectivly moving the 25% MAC further aft and that's why it looks so far aft on the root rib...just my guess.

LAST EDITED ON Feb-10-04 AT 11:16 PM (CDT)
 
That, plus the LO's are shown at the maximum forward location, not the midpoint. Build this model, Brad! The high taper reminds me of the Brian Eather "Firecracker" and many other Aussie designs with high taper. Only difference is straight flap hingeline and styling. Looks real good to me. Steve

http://www.nwskyraiders.com/index.html

I think Doug Moon needs one of these...Brad Nailer...Har!

>The wing has a large LE sweep effectivly moving the 25% MAC
>further aft and that's why it looks so far aft on the root
>rib...just my guess.

Correct. Although the CG is still at 32% MAC. More further aft than most standard designs. This is the same CG that the pattern plane uses with the fuel tank located on the CG.

If you look the CG is still AHEAD of the high point of the wing at the tip.

I will build this model later this year with the Zone 2.

Randy,

I think this approach is at least as unique, at least as unique as the utra high aspect ratio designs that you have been doing. The appraoch is simply just the opposite of high aspect ratio. The object is very high drag, moderate lift, and very aft CG for turn rate. This allows more slowing on down legs and more effective use of power and pitch without the airplane getting larger. This is the same thing the RC pattern guys are doing in transitioning from the 2 stroke tuned pipe to the 4 stroke.

I am very excited about it really...

Godzilla,

Uh, I think your first flight with it is going to be exciting. I'd worry a bit about the CG. But hey, what do I know.

With 20 oz of Saito 72 under the hood, and all that wing sweep, I bet he's ok on the CG.

You cant run the CG like that on our normal stunted with minor taper. But Brad's plane here has so much more sweep I bet it will take the CG just fine. The only thing I worry about is that the LO will have to have a guide that will extend forward of the wing at the tip. Don Hutchinson had to have this on his F-86 Stunter with a swept wing.

I told this to Brad earlier. I think the front of the fuse needs to be wider. The Canopy might look to large for the fuse once it is built. Just my thoughts...

I can be a critic...Brad and I know each other....

>You cant run the CG like that on our normal stunted with
>minor taper. But Brad's plane here has so much more sweep I
>bet it will take the CG just fine. The only thing I worry
>about is that the LO will have to have a guide that will
>extend forward of the wing at the tip.

NO!!!! WRONG!!!! (Willy Wonka imitation)

The leadouts are shown exiting the wing at the CG in the picture. They will never be forward of that position. The leadouts always exit aft of the CG.

I can yell at Doug, we are friends.

Also, expect to see a high aspect ratio version of the same type of thing from Doug. It is called Furias 2. It should be nimble beast.

I think yo should get this stuff to the cutter ASAP and get on it!

TODAY!!! TODAY BRAD!!!!

You are right about the LO exits and the CG!! I missed that one.

Godzilla,

First thought upon seeing your plans was, "I already built one of those!"

And while not literally true, it is amazing how many elements of the old "Boxer 60" RC Pattern model I did in fact build and fly are in your new model.

You are indeed talking to some certified RC Pattern Dudes.

As I remember it, the "Boxer 60" was designed using "Cursor" numbers from the Rick Allison design, the only difference of significance being the former was easier to build with its all-balsa built-up construction in the fuse, foam skinned with balsa for flight surfaces.

I saw Rick just a couple weeks ago, as he is making some noises about building one of Hunt's designs--Bob! Send Rick the plans, you misguided soul!--for CL Stunt, I'm sure he'll be interested.

Dan,

You said you built one. Or somethig similar.

Please tell us how it flew???

I am very interested.

I work with one of the principals. He has done some VERY innovative things with carbon fiber composites for the pattern fuselages. See if you can talk him into doing the fuselage in carbon instead of doing the std. balsa thing. I think you will be pleasantly surprised!

LAST EDITED ON Feb-14-04 AT 01:50 PM (CDT)
 
Dan,
You said you built one. Or somethig similar.

Please tell us how it flew???

I am very interested.

Doug Moon

Doug,

I have no idea why you would be interested, as the Boxer is an RC Pattern design, not even a current one at that.

It looped inside and outside quite accurately. Squares were not its strong suit, nor were rolling circles. It required a small amount of stick pressure to hold inverted. It would pull to the canopy in consecutive, four- and eight-point rolls. Snaps were not as clean as I would have liked, although that was a shortcoming of a great many Pattern planes of that era. Come to think of it, stalls were not as clean and abrupt as desired, leading to the problem with snaps. Vertical performance was Killer for the time, not near as good as today's 5-kg, four-stroke powered beasts.

Power was a piped two-stroke, one of 20 or so I had commissioned from a producer based in Russia. (Ultimately the deal fell through.) Slide-valve carb, copy of Webra technology. Aluminum "muffled" tuned pipe. APC 12-12 prop, standard blade not the narrow version. Fuel was 45/10/10/35 with a wee bit of propylene oxide added. Perry VP-30 pump and pipe pressure were both used at various times, although not at the same time. Of course. 16-ounce Sullivan tank with clunk.

My Boxer was unusual for the time in that it utilized fixed main gear versus the standard-practice retracts. You will notice that virtually all current RC Pattern models use fixed gear. For whatever that is worth.

Model was flown on Mode One, as I had by then converted from Mode Two.

If there is anything else you think would be of use in evaluating RC Pattern models within the context of CL Stunt, be sure to let me know.