Stuka Stunt Main Forum · 37 of 37 known posts recovered
I wouldn't recommend the Cool Power - Crist says 17%, I have seen boildown tests that put it more in the 14% area. If you can get Morgan fuels, Omega is a better choice.
SIG is 20% 50/50.
Brett
Morgan lists the percentages as 17%, but it is by weight, not volume. That comes out to about 14% by volume. Also, Omega has some, but very little castor added to it, certainly nowhere near the 50-50 blend of SIG. If you get Omega, add castor to it, all castor, and you won't go wrong by adding 7 or 8% castor by volume, not by weight. There have got to be better fuels available to you even on the other side of the ditch.
Brett is right
I have done boil down test on there fuel my self , and found a little over 14 % oil, also from what I understand the castor Omega is only 2% castor with 17 to 18 % total by weight....14% by volume. Neither is a good fuel for any engine we use in CL that I have found.
If you must use this fuel add Castor to bring up the oil content. Basic rough fiqure is to add 1.28 ounces for each percentage you want to bring the oil up to. Yes you may have to pour off a little fuel, and it will bring the notro content dowm slighlty but this does work
Regards
Randy
YEs Leonard Your right I meant 14% total oil volume i fixed it 
Didn't you mean that the other way around--14% total by volume which they measure as 17 or 18% by weight?
But I agree, without doctoring it, I wouldn't use it in any of the engines we use in stunt. And just because they advertise it as a castor/synthetic blend doesn't mean there is enough castor. 2% castor and 12% synthetic is not a good mix.
My own rule of thumb: If the manufacturer is not willing to tell you the contents--and do so by volume, then you are better off using someone's fuel who will. SIG tells you. Fox tells you. Some of the other manufacturers will tell you.
Mikey
Frankly, the best fuel I had ever used was Doug Taffinder's PAC. It had a nitro content of 7% and 22% (I think) castor oil.
Just an Old Advanced flyer. 
Before I was able to get FOX Superfuel through my club, Chicagoland Circle Cutters, I bought and used several gallons of SIG Champion fuel (both the 5% nitro 25% castor and the 10% nitro 25% castor) in all my FOX .35 engines. The SIG seemed to run just as well as the Superfuel I'm running now.
DennisV
Then a few years ago I began to notice the SIG fuel was **always exactly** what I expected. No surprises almost meant benign neglect.
Since a "D'oh!" moment I have been using SIG fuels almost exclusively, the only exception of note being YS 20/20 in the four-strokes.
I have even cut way back on the home-brew stuff by using either SIG 10% Champion or 10% All-castor as pre-mix, adding required ingredients to get a specific blend.
Excellent fuel in all ways, from a company that continues to do a pretty good job for us CL folk.
Dan
I use it and have it in STOCK.
Jim
Mike can give his answer and I welcome it. I think lubricin is a good additive for the engine. It helps the castor do its job. I think it is a bad additive for the modeler. It is a proven cancer carcinogin. I believe Doug Taffender blames this directly for his skin cancer. If you are only holding the handle and never coming into contact with it, that is one thing. If you are holding the model (playing stooge, as I often do) or simply handling the fuel, you do come into contact with it.
We always say we are not going to be the ones getting caught (that's why there are still so many smokers in the world. I ate a lot of McDonald's hamburgers and fries until I had that heart by-pass surgery). But...are you sure?
Jim,
The Lubricin was no longer needed because the properties of the Klotz oil along with the castor proved far better. Use it if you like, but I don't see a need for it.
Len,
That was Propylene Oxide not the Lubricin. To get a job at Sig is way more complicated than you think. Not only does your name have to be Mike, you must also be from Minnesota too LOL.
OK, sorry. I stand corrected. And that, I think, was banned by EPA or some such, wasn't it? Whatever, it is probably a good idea.
While I have not looked at the file in years, a doctor in Texas did some research on P.O. for me back when I was writing the instructions for the VA .049. Turned out the primary use for it was (is?) as an industrial cleaning agent, although I forget the application.
While he had quite a lot of data on the stuff, his advice was that it might not be a good idea to put it on one's corn flakes each morning, but other than that there were no serious problems.
Weird sidebar: I finally "discovered" that in a (small) stack of kits I had a NIB Skyray 35, soon to be renamed "Skyray 20" for the small-bore motor which will power it. Last night I noticed a warning label, specific to California, that the kit contains known carcinogens.
What?! It's balsa, maple, ply, a few bits of wire and plastic, some screws and a set of plans.
Ya know, we might be getting just a little jumpy about this kinda stuff...
Dan
Propylene oxide is still made, and several sources at least claim to still have some - the infamous FHS among them (the "Red Max" people, AKA, "castor oil scare story" people).
I used to run a bit of propylene oxide in my fuel, but to be honest with you, it just didn't seem to make any significant difference for stunt. I think you are better off with more nitro than with P.O.
Brett
Jim
What?! It's balsa, maple, ply, a few bits of wire and plastic, some screws and a set of plans.
Ya know, we might be getting just a little jumpy about this kinda stuff...
Dan
The flash point of P.O. is low, scary low. But 55 degrees??!!
Drop by the house. I've got some in downstairs refrigerator. We'll get it out, pour a small amount (10 ounces ought to be fun) into a shallow pan and wait for the stuff to warm up.
It will be fun. Honest.
Dan
Of course, that's not what "flash point" means. For instance, gasoline has a flash point around -40 degrees - but you car doesn't explode just because it's -35 outside.
Brett
DAN
California, that the kit contains known carcinogens.
Water in "Californa" has that same Label
scott(Idrinktap)Riese
Ron B.
F4Fguy
California tap water needs that label.
Ron B.
Pat MacKenzie
Note that this is not the auto-ignition point. All "flash point" means is that in a puddle above the flash point temperature, enough of the material evaporates at a high enough rate that an ignitable mixture can form. It still requires an ignition source.
Flash points of various materials:
gasoline.... -40
Propylene oxide .... -37
office rubber cement... -7
acetone..... -4
lacquer thinner.... 27
methanol.... 53
auto deisel.... 85
nitromethane.... 95
So PO has a low flash point, but not worse than gasoline. You can't treat it with the kind of carelessness that you do the rest of model fuel components, but in any practical sense, it's not any different from a lot of paint solvents of even items found in a lot of office supply cabinets.
Brett
Yeah, maybe we went overboard on disclosure and labeling but:
1. I've never seen the disclaimer on bottled water, even the stuff imported from France (no kidding!)
2. Lead is hazardous to people, especially kids (hand to mouth transmission). Kids of all ages, ...ahem.
What I can't figure out is when the labels and signs aren't for a specific item. Dan's kit has a small number of parts so he could figure it out. We have one sign posted at the entrance to the cafeteria. What's that for? And what's this arm growing out of my left ear?
And how come leadout wire, uh...fishing leader has a label? Stainless steel? Line clips? Fishing hooks? Is all fishing gear labeled just because it is associated with lead sinkers? Cadmium plating...?
Gotta go take a break. My head hurts from all the fine print. Arnie says that's ok. No pain, no gain.
Dave
LA_Flyer
from somewhere near Manhattan Beach, Ca
>Dan
>Of course, that's not what "flash point" means. For instance, gasoline has a flash point around -40 degrees - but you car doesn't explode just because it's -35 outside.
>Brett
Dang it! I just finished thanking the F4F Guy for straightening us out on some poorly used terms, dropped in a couple examples just to make myself feel better. And then I see where Brett caught me with a pretty serious mistake.
I guess mention should have been made of lighting my kersone heater prior to pouring a bunch of P.O. in kitty's food dish.
Dan
Nah. Here in the Kalifornia, we try to make fishing safe for the fish, too. Many of the best trout streams are catch and release so you have to use barbless hooks. They come right out.... That way we can catch the same fish dozens of times. I heard one fish was caught so many times that as soon as he felt the hook he swam straight for the shore and jumped out into the fishermans lap. Less pain and suffering that way, but it kinda ruins the sporting aspects of it all. Don't forget, we modernified dentistry the same way a few years back...I think it was just after the gold rush in '49....
Dave
LA_Flyer
from somewhere near Manhattan Beach, Kalifornia
PS--I checked the two sets of SIG lines I recently purchased. The packaging on both had "add-on" stickers with the Prop 65 warning label. A brief inventory: red plastic spool, shiny metal clip for spool, stranded .015 stainless wire, silver colored ferrules for crimping, line clips, plastic bag, paper label, staple to secure hazardous materials safely(?) within plastic bag. ???