biasing maneuvers?

Some pretty good flyers bias maneuvers....some a little, some a lot.

What is the opinion as to how these maneuvers should be biased, and should judges anticipate that they will be biased and attempt to move to gain better perspective?

See Ya

>Some pretty good flyers bias maneuvers....some a little,
>some a lot.
>
>What is the opinion as to how these maneuvers should be
>biased, and should judges anticipate that they will be
>biased and attempt to move to gain better perspective?
>

How? The question is more like "how much". TP airplanes, not very much until the wind really gets going. 4-2 break (ST46/60, etc), maybe 30 degrees in a 10 mph wind, 45 degree in a 20 mph wind (until you get blown out of the vertical 8).

I usually move over in the anticipated direction when judging. It's not that far, usually, and you can still see the maneuver OK with it off 15-20 degrees.

Brett:
I try my best to remain upwind when I judge......I move between maneuvers .
I am happy to move to where a flyer points (I do not move DURING a maneuver)....
The problem with watching a biasing flyer is that sometimes, especially when I am not 180 from the maneuver, I start to think that the maneuver was better than it looked from my position.....
One that I have the privilage to judge with at the Nats zooms all over the place to keep himself 180 from the maneuver....I have tried to keep up and he flat wears me out.
I believe that there is a significant difference to judge from a vantage point that the flyer indicates (even if wrong) than to anticipate changes in vantage point because the flyer biases ......

See Ya

It's not that far, usually, and you can still see
>the maneuver OK with it off 15-20 degrees.
>
> Brett

Brett, I'm delighted at last to find someone who agrees with me on this. Over here, (England) there seems to be a strong majority opinion for judges to dash from side to side as we get variations in wind direction. More than 15-20 I'm happy to move, but within those limits I find the moving is more distracting to me than staying put and, as you say, still seeing the manoeuvre.

>It's not that far, usually, and you can still see
>>the maneuver OK with it off 15-20 degrees.
>>
>> Brett
>
>Brett, I'm delighted at last to find someone who agrees with
>me on this. Over here, (England) there seems to be a strong
>majority opinion for judges to dash from side to side as we
>get variations in wind direction.

Oh, two different topics. Rich is talking about the bias to either side of prevailing wind. You are talking about movement of the judge to get in line with the prevailing wind. I think the judge should *always* move as the wind moves +- how much you move for the bias. Plus it says so in the rulebook. There is of course a limit to everything (both a threshold and a maximum), but I always move to stay in line with where I think the wind as it shifts. I.e., the diametric opposite of the old FAI rules where the judges just sit in one spot no matter what.

Since I both fly and judge, I can't begin to just stand there with the wind ont eh side of my face, judging manevuers. Just seems wrong to me. But to each his own.

Brett, I'm really talking about moving for whatever reason, either each side of prevailing wind or for any other reason,the effect on viewing is the same. As you point out, the rules indicate moving, so it has to be done, but a lot of the time I agree, and think it is unnecessary.

I've decided not to bias maneuvers in really strong wind. The advantages of biasing the maneuvers are outweighed by the difficulty of maintaining the same track in consecutive maneuvers, particularly without a lot of practice in extreme conditions. I have a pipe and a pretty well-behaved airplane, though.

Howard,

I agree with you (there's something). I used to try to bias maneuvers to take advantage in the wind, but found that I had a really hard time keeping my own timing together. Any more, I just fly dead down wind. If the wind shifts, I try to move my maneuver a bit, but will usually just stay where I start. It seems less distracting and I find I usually fly better that trying to hunt all over for the "right" spot.

But that's probably just me.

LAST EDITED ON May-02-04 AT 01:10 AM (CDT)
 
When I judge, I don't feel my opinion of wind direction matters, as to where the contestant should place his maneuver. The contestant should point where he wants to do the maneuvers, and I should be 180 from it. I don't like to be 10' outside the circle, or running, but especially not both. Good way to get hit in the back of the headbone. If I'm 80 to 90 feet from the flier, it's likely he will feel different wind than I do, and he should be flying where his airplane is telling him to fly. I've flown (F1A) when the wind was fairly strong, 180 degrees different from about 50' altitude to 170'...strange experience, and thankfully, rare. In that situation, the contestant is the only one that can know where to fly, and where the judges should be. And he/she'll probably be very puzzled, too. Steve

Howard...My opinion is that those that bias a bunch get lower scores from me on the early portion of the pattern than after the triangles.... and I believe it is because the biasing, while "feeling" good, distorts the maneuvers a bunch?

See Ya

At VSC this year the wind was ferocious on Sunday. There where 18 of us flyers out of 78-80 entrants in Classic stunt who flew. Awards for the first ten places were presented. While I didn't have a chance at any hardware flying an ARF flight streak (Lost my stuka 7 days before) I figured the experience would be good.

Flight watch said the wind was 15 gusting 25 knots that day.

this is what I learned:

It was the last official flight of the day in perhaps the strongest wind of the day.

I biased my maneuvers to either the right or left of downwind such that the top of the maneuvers were flying into the wind. On a couple occassions I was more directly downwind and the windup was fierce.

On another maneuver I was biased more upwind than the others and the top of speed differential was very noticably slower than the bottoms thus affecting the shape significantly. All in all it was a great experience.

Bob Palmer told me what he did in South Africa in a windy championship. So I did the following prior to the flight.

Shortened my lines 2 feet
Added 1/4 oz wingtip weight
Increased prop pitch 1 inch
increased engine rpm by 300
leadouts were fixed but I would have moved them back 1/8th inch if possible.

Results!! There was only one time where the lines went slack momentarilly but immediately regained control over the top. All in all a secure flight albeit quite fast.

Overall, biasing in wind is probably a good thing but should be done with much preplanning and concentration. Stay on your toes.

Bob Smiley
A Lancair 360 builder/pilot trying to be a modeler