Stuka Stunt Control Line Forum
Archive, 2000–2021 · recovered from the Internet Archive
Forums › Stuka Stunt Main Forum

How Hard is it to Build Al Rabe's Airplanes?

Stuka Stunt Main Forum · 27 of 27 known posts recovered · the forum listed 31 replies

F4FGuy · Nov 23, 2006 12:15 PM

edited# source
Ron B.
F4Fguy

Al:

Great stuff! I couldn't agree more. Our methodology may differ,but,ultimately,it's no more difficult to build a realistic "scale stunter" than a conventional modern stunt airplane.

The dihedral,swept trailing edges (forward or back) are elements which can (in some cases should) have application even in non "scale" stunters. This also applies to molded fuselages,and jig built structures of any kind.

The only comment I'd make is re time. I don't think there's much if any,difference,if you're building an existing design. I find that most of the time is in design,and in solving the problems that inevitably crop up when truly "scratch" building.

I do most of my molds in Spider-Foam,carved "solid model" style. It's fast and easy and automatically corrects any minor lofting errors.Templates used for developing cross-section are simply plan sections Spray-mented to foamboard. Shaping is done with a Surform plane. This yields a rather rough surface,but an accurate shape,and that's all thats needed.

My wings are either cored Spider-Foam with 1/32" 8# sheeting or "Lost Foam" fully sheeted with either 1/20" 8# or 1/16"6# depending on size. Either method is essentially self jigging with the foam cradles and any amount of dihedral can be built in easily.

I also use different method for the horn/sweep problem. The flap ends are maple blocks slotted deeply to act as "Lucky" boxes.the trailing edge is cut straight so that a line projected along the hinge intersects the (projected) corner of the horn wire and axis. It's simple,effective,and "0" residual stress on the structure.*

*See Photo.

Al,please don't take any of the above as criticism,it's just to show "there's a lot of ways to skin a cat" and this is my way. The bottom line is; there's little difference between building a truly realistic "scale stunter" and a conventional peas in a pod stunter.

Ron B.

Attachment #1, (jpg file)

Ron B.
F4Fguy

jehold66203 · Apr 16, 2005 03:40 AM

#3 source
Al & RonB, great to see post like this. Now I would like to see how RonB does his hinges with the center pivot so far off on the control horn. Keep up the terrific work. -DOC Holliday
DOC Holliday

dinoj4 · Apr 16, 2005 03:48 AM

#4 source
Al, is your Mustang classic legal? I know Kieth Trostle flies your Bearcat in classic, right? Do you have some new tapes available? Thanks, John from Va

Al Rabe · Apr 16, 2005 03:58 AM

edited#5 source
John,

I have just remade some of the BBQB Bearcat tapes updating them to a new BBFB standard. If Kyle decides to cut eight segment shells, all the structure will be very much like the BBFB. One builder is already building a Bearcat III using a BBFB video set. He claims to be satisfied with the videos and their usefulness in his construction of a classic legal airplane.

Sorry, Dino, Of course the Mustang III is classic legal.

Al
Al Rabe

Randy Powell · Apr 16, 2005 05:16 AM

#6 source
Dino,

I believe the Mustang III is classic legal.

dinoj4 · Apr 16, 2005 10:46 AM

#7 source
Thanks for the reply, Al and Randy, now the next question, or questions are: What is the size of the Mustang? I believe it uses a .46, and what does BBQB stand for? Thanks again, John from Va.

Al Rabe · Apr 16, 2005 12:16 PM

#8 source
John,

The classic Mustang III was designed for a .46 but now that good larger engines are available, I'd use at least a .60.

Big Bearcat, Quick Build

Al
Al Rabe

Uncle Mikey · Apr 16, 2005 03:37 PM

#9 source
With apparent renewing interest in semi-scale Stunters, one can only hope we'll see another appearance of the model that SHOULD have been in the front row that year at the Nats: Ron Burns' F4F Wildcat.

(Ron: if it no longer exists, how about building another one? I'd bet that your realistic flat finish would get its "props" NOW.)

Uncle Mikey
Mike Keville

F4FGuy · Nov 23, 2006 12:15 PM

#16 source
Ron B.
F4Fguy

Third time's a charm,I guess.

Mike:

The '88 Wildcat was lost to pilot error in (I think) '90/'91. The second one met a similar fate acouple of years ago. Ironically,the Zero which was to be it's stablemate,survives. Probably because i have NOOOO place to fly it within a 3-4 hour radius.Soccer fields with tall grass are not kind to working scale oleos.

I have a wing cut and CF skinned for a new F4F-3. If you keep sweet talkin' I'll just have to get crackin' on it.

Attached are some pics of Wildcat MarkII and the A6M3-22.

Thanks for the kind words.

Ron B.

Now! Let's see if we can send this without deleting it this time!

Attachment #1, (jpg file)
Attachment #2, (jpg file)
Attachment #3, (jpg file)
Attachment #4, (jpg file)

Ron B.
F4Fguy

Uncle Mikey · Apr 17, 2005 01:37 AM

#10 source
Ron:

Fan-TAS-tic!!!

Uncle Mikey
Mike Keville

Al Rabe · Apr 17, 2005 08:01 AM

edited#12 source
I really don’t know how to say this, but I’ll try. It has always chapped my butt to have someone refer to one of my airplanes as a “semi-stunt scale ship”. When I attended my first NATs in 1968, I crossed the line from hobbyist to competitor. Since then, excepting the Mustunt series, I have never built a stunt ship that wasn’t intended to compete at the highest level of National and World competition. I like designing and flying realistic looking airplanes but there has always been an overriding imperative that my airplanes not be compromised in performance.

Thirty years ago, when someone would make a comment suggesting that my airplanes were less, somehow, than “real” stunt ships, I’d feel a serious obligation to meet them in competition to prove the error of their assumptions. In the January 1978 issue of Model Airplane News, in an article by Chris Lella about the 1977 FAI team trials, Chris remarked about the practice flights before the competition, “no one except Al Rabe looked like he should represent the over 200 million people who are called “America.” Werwage didn’t make the team. No one there thought I was flying a semi-stunt scale ship. Well, I didn’t fly semi-stunt airplanes then, and I don’t now. The difference being that, at age 69, I don’t have the energy to really “campaign”, to quiet those with preconceived ideas about what will and won’t fly competitively with my old tactic of being convincingly successful in competition.

The airplanes discussed in my post have a pedigree of competition capability. Like any other stunt ships there is no guaranteed formula for a winning airplane. The formula is to build light, straight, trim and power them well and practice, practice, practice. It is a serious error in judgment to consider semi-scale airplanes somehow “handicapped”.

Al

Al Rabe

wavyhill · Apr 17, 2005 05:08 PM

#14 source
Al,

Still think your Sea Fury is the most attractive stunt ship I have ever seen in print (never saw it in person). I still have that issue of MA and I read it every so often. The article is inspiring.

Too bad someone hasn't kitted that one for us "building impaired" types.

Steve
a.k.a. Wavyhill
Steve
a.k.a. Wavyhill

Jeff W · Apr 17, 2005 07:04 PM

#15 source
>Al,
>
>Still think your Sea Fury is the most attractive stunt ship
>I have ever seen in print (never saw it in person). I still
>have that issue of MA and I read it every so often. The
>article is inspiring.
>
>Too bad someone hasn't kitted that one for us "building
>impaired" types.
>
>Steve
>a.k.a. Wavyhill

I was there for the years Al flew the Sea Fury's. Take your dreams and multiply by 10, and you'll be headed in the right direction. Of all the things I've seen and done in model Aviation, Al's Sea Fury in flight will probably the last one to fade from my memory. And by the way, in many ways the man is very much like the machine, or possibly the other way around. Neither one will be duplicated.

Jeff Welliver

Randy Powell · Apr 17, 2005 07:44 AM

#11 source
Ron,

Man, you build nice stuff. Beautiful.

Al Rabe · Nov 23, 2006 12:15 PM

edited#0 source
I get a lot of questions about just how hard my airplanes are to build. Many think they must be hard to build because of the dihedral and swept forward hinge line. Molded parts and realistic appearance are also daunting. Some builders think they are can build them with only plans and parts. They are both missing some very important points. I'll try to offer fair judgments and details as to why these judgments are accurate. Follow along, the changes in aerodynamics and structures are cumulative.

[photo not recovered: 425eaf3337c1376e.jpg]

MUSTANG II

The Mustang II was published in June 1969 American Aircraft Modeler. It was a slight upgrade of the airplane I flew at 1968 NATs. It had a dramatic appearance for 1968 and flew reasonably well. Being an early design, in was of relatively conventional structure. It had dihedral, but a straight trailing edge. It was a basic, simple airplane. Anyone could build one from plans. Why wasn't it more popular with builders? Dihedral, mostly, I think, and it didn't look much like an airplane that would do a decent pattern. I used it to qualify at my first NATs. Many builders are afraid of dihedral’s effects on flying characteristics. Some don't want to try building wings with dihedral, thinking them difficult to build accurately. As for the aerodynamics, there have been enough successful competition airplanes to demonstrate dihedral, properly used, has no ill effect on an airplane’s ability to fly a competitive pattern. It’s simply a matter of putting the leadouts in the proper location, the Vertical CG. Most low wing stunt ships would profit from a bit of dihedral, particularly the popular profile warbirds with low wings. As for difficulty in construction, there isn't any greater difficulty if the tube type jig is used. I used my tube type jig to build both straight wings, for Mustunts, and dihedraled wings. The only difference in building a dihedral wing is the jig tube holes go through the top of the center section ribs and through the bottom of the tip ribs. Actual construction of both is identical. I published the first tube type wing jigs in that Mustang article. I didn't like the only available jig at the time, the Ajusto Jig. I didn't think that Ajusto's 1/4" rods offered enough support to ribs. Also, I could buy aluminum tubes cheaply through Braniff’s company stock room. Many builders think jig tubes are superior for wing building, but, simple as tube type jigs are, their use has also improved over the years.


[photo not recovered: 425eaf7b384c345e.jpg]


OK, Building wings with dihedral presents no problems with structure, but what about the flap horns? At first, I used double flap horns as being a compromise solution knowing that there would be some asymmetry at maximum control deflections. This solution would minimize friction in the control system. Later, I found that long flap horns could be "bowed" around the wing center section trailing edge. I was amazed to find that four low friction bearings could exert enough force on the wing trailing edge that the structure would have to be temporarily braced to keep the ribs from pulling loose. The temporary bracing could be removed when some of the sheeting was in place. There is very little difference in the friction of "loaded" bearings as opposed to unloaded straight horn bearings. The difference can't be felt in flight, and my flaps hang from their own weight like anyone else's. The trick here is not to bend the flap horn, just "bow" it. Flap horns "bent" to the shape of the wing trailing edge will have some "spring" in them, and will tend to move toward and remain in some position. I install "bowed" horns by sanding a bit of curve into the wing trailing edge to eliminate the sharp angle where the wing panels meet. Next, two bearings on one side of the horn are laced to the trailing edge with many wraps of thread. Then the other end of the horn is pulled into position with a little force and secured with wraps of thread. Once installed and lubricated, there is little difference in friction of the "bowed" and straight 3/32” horns. Sometimes, it is possible with dihedral or swept forward trailing edges to simply glue the horns into the flaps as though the dihedral or sweep doesn’t exist. I got away with this gluing 1/8” horn wires into the BBQB Bearcat flaps. When I tried this on the Millennium II flaps, they were “springy” on “down”. I fixed this by adding “lucky boxes” in the flaps to obtain smooth operation in full flap deflections up and down. My new Sanggletooth II has 3/32” “bowed“ flap horns.

The Mustang II had conventional fuselage construction with sheet sides and hollowed top and bottom blocks. This airplane is easy to build, but better alternatives exist.

BEARCAT II

The Bearcat II was published in the March 1970 issue of American Aircraft Modeler. The wing construction was identical to the Mustang II with dihedral, straight trailing edge and dual flap horns. The fuselage was conventional with sheet sides and hollowed blocks on the top and bottom. This article introduced the reversed bellcrank and sliding block adjustable leadouts. This airplane was easily to build, managed a second at the NATs, but better alternatives exist.

MUSTANG III

The Classic Mustang III was a 1969 design. It featured a much improved wing with an improved airfoil and swept forward wing trailing edge to trade wing area for flap area for increased lift without changing the apparent outline of the wing. The fuselage construction was conventional. The wing construction featured the "bowed" flap horn. When the Flap horn is "bowed" to accommodate dihedral, it will also accommodate trailing edge sweep with no difference in friction or change in installation. A bow in the horn is a bow in the horn, whether from dihedral or trailing edge sweep. No plans were published until 30 years later when I made a drawing intended to update the magazine plans. Now, this drawing for the Mustang III is available from PAMPA. These plans are actually updates for the magazine plans and, as such, are poor stand alone construction drawings. Still, the airplane is classic legal, attractive, and a good flying airplane. Bill Rutherford used his Mustang III to place third at the NATs. Mustang III wing kits are available from tanks-hangar.com. Mustang III canopys are available from [email protected].

[photo not recovered: 425eafab38c03f4d.jpg]


BEARCAT III

The classic Bearcat III was also a 1969 design. It featured light weight construction with a molded balsa fuselage and an improved wing similar to the Mustang III. It had dihedral, swept forward trailing edge, improved airfoil and the now familiar "bowed" flap horn. It was also an update of a published airplane, the Bearcat II. As I built, parts were traced onto the plans update. As a result, the Bearcat III drawings available from PAMPA are helpful but not truly construction drawings either. With some demand for laser cut parts, I had Kyle put the Bearcat III wing into his computer. Later, in response to request, Kyle copied the Bearcat III drawings and incorporated BBQB longerons, engine installation and jig building of the fuselage. He also molds full length fuselage shells from my molds and sells them. This isn't a completely successful package as there are conflicts between the assembly of the Bearcat III and BBQB. Still, with a bit of determination, and thoughtful resolution of apparent conflicts, the lightweight Bearcat III can be duplicated. Fuselage parts fit. It’s just a little difficult to decide what to do with them. For now the construction is a bit of a mixed bag but the airplane flies well. Keith trostle just won Classic at VSC flying a Bearcat. Maybe I can get together with Kyle and fix the fuselage. If we update the Bearcat III, it will then include eight segment shells. With eight segment shells, the airplane will build much like the BBQB. BBQB videos would then be a big help in building the Bearcat III. These segmented shells will cost more due to the extra labor, but they'll be worth it. Canopys are available from [email protected].

[photo not recovered: 425eafda3d724dd7.jpg]


MUSTANG V, VI, VII (Snaggletooth)

The molded Mustangs were a no holds bared attempt to build a World Championship airplane. It was a near miss. Snaggletooth only managed a second place in the World Championship, but it did win the 1977 NATs and Walker Trophy. Molded Mustangs featured many changes from the airplanes which preceded it. In general, they had; molded fuselages, built up control surfaces with a spruce I-beam stab spars, Dihedral, swept forward wing trailing edges, a still further improved airfoil, internal mufflers, stab incidence, "canted" tanks, “canted engines”, "reverse asymmetry" and shock gears. Does this make it nearly impossible to duplicate? Not really, Last year I updated the Snaggletooth design with laser cutting, provisions for larger engines, removable tank, and mold forms for easier mold construction. I drew new plans, revised and updated the structure, made building/assembly videos and worked with Kyle to get parts into the computer for laser cutting. There was a lot of effort expended to make Snaggletooth easily buildable. John Hill built nine of these Mustangs before laser cutting. Now he is working on a new Mustang utilizing both laser cut parts and modifications from years of building these airplanes.

[photo not recovered: 425ec0030e5d37ed.jpg]

Ok, but how hard is it to build? Actually, it is very straight forward but involves making of molds and the use of many new and different building technologies. The molds are easy to make using mold forms included in the Snaggletooth kit. The plywood mold forms are visable in the photo above. They are simply filled with “drywall compound” (plaster) and shaped with a “Stanley Sureform” plane from Home Depot. Drywall compound cuts easier, and sands better than balsa. The fuselage is assembled in supplied jig pockets. Bulkheads are laminated balsa and plywood. The wing is assembled on a tube type jig and is straight forward except for the application of sheeting. The tail surfaces are airfoiled and built with spruce I-beam spars. The laser cut kit supplies most of the parts and is fairly complete down to the included gear doors. The construction is time consuming but easy enough if the Sanggletooth videos are used for reference. Without the videos, it would be difficult to even recognize the function of about a third of the parts. I think the videos are necessary to successfully build the airplane. I'm not nearly as interested in selling videos as in making sure that all of the necessary information necessary to build a competitive airplane is available. Perhaps several builders could pool their resources and share videos. Kyle sells the parts and offers molded leading edges. We had considered including foam leading edge molds with the laser cut parts, but decided it would be easier and cheaper to just offer the molded leading edges finished. [email protected] sells canopys. Plans are only available with the videos. The plans can’t cover the many unusual details of the construction and would be considered incomplete without the videos.

[photo not recovered: 425eaffb3dc6a0cf.jpg]


BBQB/BBFB BEARCAT

The big molded Bearcats are also reasonably easy to build, IF videos, laser cut parts, and molded parts are used. In fact, with all of the components above, the aircraft’s primary structure can be assembled in about 40 hours. With laser cut and molded parts, the fuselage and fuselage jigs can be assembled in about 9 hours. The wing construction is fairly conventional using molded leading edge, tube type jig, BBQB bellcrank mount, and sheeting of .077 balsa. The airfoiled tail surfaces are easily built taking only about 4 hours for the entire set. If your think the videos unnecessary, take a look at the accompanying photos.

[photo not recovered: 425eb02b3e5e45da.jpg]


OK, with parts, both molded and laser cut, construction isn’t difficult but there is a lot of it. Regardless of how fast the basic structure goes together, it takes months of occasional building before a BBQB/BBFB is ready for paint. The BBFB refers to faster build and the availability of three engine mounting configurations. The Bearcat now can be built for a Saito .91, a Saito .72, or any of the larger PA and Ro-Jett engines from .61 to .76. The structure of the fuselage and the assembly of the fuselage to the wing has been updated, and videos, as appropriate, have been remade.

[photo not recovered: 425eb0483e97d1c7.jpg]

The biggest fly in the ointment is the molded fuselage shells. The BBQB/BBFBs are designed to be assembled about the lower fuselage longerons. The lower fuselage longeron is located on the wing leading and trailing edge centerlines, the flap trailing edge and the length of the removable cowling. Upper and lower, forward and rear, molded shells join on those longerons. The shells are molded in four pieces, then precision cut into upper and lower pieces for a total of eight shell segments. The shell segments are first trimmed of excess balsa which overlapped the mold backing. This requires a simple cutting tool. Next, the molds, with the shells attached, must be mounted vertically and longitudinally adjusted for cuts which will separate upper and lower segments of the front and rear shells at the center of the lower longeron. The front and rear shells are separated with another cutting tool. Shell segments are cut to length, by the builder, using marks left on the inside of the shells by staples driven into “A” and “D” mold bulkheads. Cutting tools and alignment jigs are necessary to the process of cutting the shells. Some builders have made their own molds and the tools to cut the shells, but, again, it is easier, and in the long run, cheaper just to get the eight segment shells from Kyle.

Kyle sells the laser cut parts, molded leading edges, and eight segment shell parts. Canopys are available from [email protected]. Plans and videos are available from me. The plans are incomplete as build alone construction drawings, and must be complemented by the videos. Building a BBQB isn't cheap, but then, If we are honest, no stunt ship is. Some builders consider the videos as optional, but they are really necessary to the construction of a competition quality airplane. Also, they offer 34 hours of video entertainment while you build. Again, construction videos could be shared by a number of builders. The construction isn’t difficult but it takes awhile. The result is an excellent competition airplane, stunning in its realistic appearance and performance.





Attachment #1, (jpg file)
Attachment #2, (jpg file)
Attachment #3, (jpg file)
Attachment #4, (jpg file)
Attachment #5, (jpg file)
Attachment #6, (jpg file)
Attachment #7, (jpg file)
Attachment #8, (jpg file)

Al Rabe

Broken Wings · Apr 14, 2005 07:24 AM

#1 source
It's easy if your Al Rabe. (Smiles)

Regards,
John Jolley

Regards,
John Jolley

Circle Burner · Apr 14, 2005 08:37 AM

#2 source
Hello Al,

This is a cool thread, I would love to build a Bearcat. It's my favorite airplane out of that era. Tons of horsepower, big 4 blade prop, great guns, and the tough Grumman look, used by the orginal Blue Angels...how can you not want to build one!

The fuse reminds me of the old Top Flite Warbirds that had the molded fuse components. However you have taken it well beyond and it looks like a lot of fun to build!

John

Proparc · Apr 17, 2005 12:41 PM

#13 source
Ron B., That Zero is too much!! Is there any chance of getting more pictures? Why were you keeping that one under wraps?
Milton Graham\Proparc

mpa · Feb 17, 2007 07:14 PM

#24 source
Milton,
Ron's Zero *has* been around a while. I took these pictures at the 2003 Golden State Stunt Championships in Clovis.
Al- if I lived closer to Texas, I'd have pictures of your planes too.
Derek

[photo not recovered: 22232.jpg]


[photo not recovered: 22233.jpg]


[photo not recovered: 22234.jpg]

Attachment #1, (jpg file)
Attachment #2, (jpg file)
Attachment #3, (jpg file)

Labor · Feb 16, 2007 07:30 AM

#17 source
Al,

Please, what is a "lucky box" on flaps. Can you post some picture about this? I did the "bow horn" on my new airplane and have this spring problem.

Juan

Bill Little · Feb 16, 2007 11:32 AM

edited#18 source
>Al,
>
>Please, what is a "lucky box" on flaps. Can you post
>some picture about this? I did the "bow horn" on my
>new airplane and have this spring problem.
>
>Juan

HI Juan,

I don't want to steal Al's thunder, but a "Lucky Box" is where you build a "slotted" compartment in the flap so that the flap horn wire can slide horizontally in the flap. RSM makes these as a parts package. I have seen 1/8th X 3/8th K&S rectangluar brass tubing inlet into the flap for this, also.

Bill Suarez told me to take a Dremel with a round bit of the correct size and "fan it out up in the flap" through a single entry hole, then soak with thin CA glue. This I would use on a 35 size plane.

Any of these just allow the horn wire some side to side movement inside the flap while moving through its range of motion.

I have the ribs to build a Classic legal Mustang III before too long and will use a PA51 or 61 (both RE) on muffler.

Big Bear <><
Character: It's what you do when no one else is watching.

Al Rabe · Feb 16, 2007 11:34 AM

edited#19 source
Juan,

If you are trying to fix your new airplane with the springy controls, I don't think that a lucky box will help now.

a common mistake when attempting to use a bowed horn to accommodate swept trailing edge or dihedral is to bend the horn to fit the trailing edge instead of just bowing it. A bowed horn used a straight horn wire with bends only at the ends for inserting into the flaps. One side of the horn is fixed to the wing trailing edge. I lace mine to the wing trailing edge with many wraps of thread. The other end of the horn wire is pulled into place against the wing trailing edge on the other side. It commonly takes quite a bit of force to hold it in position while it is secured to the trailing edge. Once again, I lace it with thread. If the bend is extreme, it may try too pull the trailing edge loose from the ribs until the sheeting is in place. This may require temporary reinforcement. The marvelous thing about bowed horns is that once they are in place they magically rotate in their bearings near as free as if the horn was straight. Any minor additional friction is not detectable in flight. Flaps droop when the airplane is at rest like any other free flap horn installation.

[photo not recovered: 22231.jpg]


I didn't answer your question directly abut the lucky box. I wanted to find a negative of a photo I used in a Stunt News article. Then I had to copy it and run it through Photoshop. The lucky box shows, from right to left, a lucky box installed in the flap, lucky box structure showing the plywood bottom, balsa spacer, and the plywood top. The plywood top and bottom are 1/32" ply. The spacer is the thickness of your flap horn, in this case, 1/8". The entry to the lucky box can be as small as the flap horn. It then must widen to allow a bit of side to side to travel of the horn end as the flaps move up and down. The assembly is 3/16" total. When installed in a 3/8" flap it is faired with the flap by adding 3/32" balsa to and the bottom in the flap cutout and shaped to a smooth continuous surface.

Al Rabe


Attachment #1, (jpg file)

ferocious · Feb 17, 2007 02:47 PM

#22 source
Another way to do something similar is to sand the TE flat, perpendicular to the chord, out to where the horn bends are. Then bend the ends of the horn until they are perpendicular to the angled trailing edge. This reduces the amount of "wiggle" in the horn ends almost to zero for 20 deg. or so on either side of neutral. If you want, make the horn holes in the flap one drill size over and fill them with silicon rubber glue when installing the flap. This gives a slight bit of give to take up the wiggle of the horn end.
Phil C

F4FGuy · Feb 17, 2007 05:22 PM

#23 source

Ron B.
F4Fguy

Absolutely correct! The bowed wire gives uniform motion at any point on it's arc.Probably the best known example is the first Pontiac "Tempest" with the "spaghetti" drive. Front engine, rear transmission, one piece bowed drive shaft with no universal joints. Another is the "Bowden cable" used in speedo drives.

There are other ways to accomplish the same end though. See my way in an earlier reply in this thread.

Ron B.

Trostle · Feb 16, 2007 02:48 PM

#20 source

"Lucky Boxes" are easy to fabricate yourself. However, RSM distribution has them in their catalog with the phenolic material to make them smooth and will last a long time. They are available for 3/32" and 1/8" wire horns and they are cheap.

http://www.rsmdistribution.com/index-2.htm

Keith

Randy Powell · Feb 17, 2007 01:55 PM

#21 source
My current plane is using an Al Rabe type construction method for the fuselage. I've been designing the jigs and it's been interesting. Lofting the fuse formers to get them close to the final shape was pretty easy, A lot of that was by guess and by golly sort of "figurin'". I'm working a sort of divergent method to mold the skins that is somewhat like Ron's method using the lofted formers as guides. We'll see how it comes out.

GWassenaar · Feb 19, 2007 04:56 AM

#25 source
Al , I have been reading your information on balsa wet moulding with open mouth and panting.

I have tried with some success to emulate your method of moulding, on wing leading edge deckings. Now I want to mould a half shell for a fuselage, where the circonference of the buck is bigger than my balsa planks. What does one do? Do you glue planks together before or after shaping on the buck? I have already found that the balsa is sufficiently pliable to follow the buck shape in one go, so if I had wide enough planks there would be no problem. This in it self is something people around me did not believe.
Gerben Wassenaar