Dare I Fly It ?!?

I just finished an ARF SCORE last weekend. Dry weight is approx. 78 oz. This includes 1-1/4 oz. of tip wt. and a 1 oz. spinner wt. for the first flights. Balance point seems close to perfect, but it could be little tail heavy; hence the spinner weight.

I don't post much on the forums because I can't add pictures. Except for fuselage mounted carbon gear and (if you look close) an adjustable rudder, it looks a lot like any other SCORE. However, there are many internal changes, all of which resulted in a net weight gain. Takeoff weight (with fuel) could approach a whopping 85 ounces. It's set up to take .46 to .61 engines, but at this weight it's unlikely anything less than a strong .51 would fly it.

Normally I'd fly something like this on .018 cable. I've read about a proposed rules change that would require .021 for models this heavy. I forgot to pay my PAMPA dues this year, so I'm not sure if that proposal has passed. I have a set of .021 lines, but they look like suspension bridge cables! At the local field, .018s are still being used for everything above a .40, including a RO-Jett .76 powered STREGA, an electric SCORE that pulls as hard as the STREGA, plus several ST .60 powered models.

I'm thinking two .018s should be fine on a calm day and for the first "short tank" test hops. I'll be able to judge quickly from the "pull" whether I should go to heavier lines, especailly in wind. All this assumes that it flies at all! So, I sign off by repeating the title: Dare I Fly It ?!?

Here is the AMA safety code for CL (2008, just downloaded)

1. I will subject my complete control system (including the safety thong where applicable) to an inspection and pull test prior to flying. The pull test will be in
accordance with the current for the applicable model aircraft category. Model aircraft not fitting a specific category shall use those pulltest
requirements as indicated for Control Line Precision Aerobatics.
2. I will ensure that my flying area is clear of all utility wires or poles and I will not fly a model aircraft closer than 50 feet to any above-ground electric utility lines.
3. I will ensure that my flying area is clear of all nonessential participants and spectators before permitting my engine to be started.

Note that it doesn't say anything about line size, but you need to do a pull test, otherwise if something happens, you might find yourself without insurance coverage from AMA.

If you stay below a 0.7629 engine, and use above a 0.46, then the pull test is 45 lbs. If you use electric then the pull test would be 10 times the weight or probably at least 53 lbs (using your estimated 85oz final weight).

I make no editorial comment about this stuff, but just point out what you need to do to be within the AMA safety code. Obviously if you compete, then you would need 0.018 diameter lines added to the mix.

I too own a Score, mine comes in at 62oz. with a ST 51 up front. I added an ounce of lead to the tail and 3/4 of an ounce of tip weight. What changes did you make that resulted in the 78oz. plane? I can tell you that in level flight mine pulls like a truck. Fill us in with some of the details, like engine size and what changes you made.
Andy

Hi Alan, I recently pull tested it twice, 50 to 60 pounds, and nothing broke. I don't think it will ever pull this much, even in a strong wind.

Lines are a new set from Tom Morris .018 inch X 64 feet. I used a Sig 4" black nylon bellcrank, Brodak .033" leadout cable, and a large Carl Siefert handle.

Regards, Ed Prohaska

Hello,I have an ARF Strega,ST-60,Came with warped wings and flies like a piece of lead.I have tried every thing.When it flies level it pulls like a frieght train,.021 lines,terrible in the wind.Too big,give me a Nobler any day.GE

PW's B-17 Stunters weighed as much as 103 oz and flew on .018's or the solid equivalent...I think .018" braids, tho. Pretty quick laps, too. Paul said he could only fly it 3 times a day, as I recall, due to fatigue, and he was pumpin' iron at the time. Your Score should be fine. Look for a PM about picture posting. [photo not recovered: sipcof.gif] Steve

Steve Helmick
Renton, Washington
USA

>PW's B-17 Stunters weighed as much as 103 oz and flew on
>.018's or the solid equivalent...I think .018" braids,
>tho. Pretty quick laps, too. Paul said he could only fly it 3
>times a day, as I recall, due to fatigue, and he was pumpin'
>iron at the time. Your Score should be fine. Look for a PM
>about picture posting. [photo not recovered: sipcof.gif] Steve
>
>Steve Helmick
>Renton, Washington
>USA

Yes, and as I recall that was the light B-17!

That is a pretty chunky Score. Too heavy to fly? I doubt it.

If nothing else a model such as this will give you ready and identifiable feedback during the trimming process. Take advantage of the situation.

You probably did little or nothing to cause the model to be so porky; an unknown percentage of (B)ARF customers are bound to get all bad wood, an approximately equal percentage will see a good bit of nice wood in their models, the rest of us will get average models.

It's one of (several) negatives associated with this type of model...


Dan

Hi Dan, Actually I probably have a lot to do with it being on the hefty side. When it comes to ARFs I just can't leave "almost well enough" alone!

I did not check the weight before starting on it, but it "felt" comparable to several SCORES built by another club member. The individual components seemed relatively light, at least by my "standards".

Beefing the front end for sixty size engines, upgrading the control system with heavier parts, using a 6 oz. metal tank, fuselage mounted landing gear, and thorough fuel proofing, all added considerable mass. Regards, Ed Prohaska

The ARF Strega is popular in the local club. I'm a Brodak dealer and have sold 7 kits! I flew 2 of these and it does pull hard. It seems to need lots of power. One club member was flying his last night with an old style 2-ring ST .56 and the engine sounded great, but the plane needs more power.

Locally, the best ARF Strega is flying with a very smooth running PA .61 but I have not flown this model. I did get to fly one with a RO-Jett .76 shoehorned in the nose! The engine is a jewel. It would fly a Buick (and the plane pulls like one) but it does power through a pretty stiff wind.

My 5 pound SCORE (which now has 2 test flights on it) has a steady and robust, but surprisingly manageable pull. That's a relief to me, because I'm 61 and have some health issues that include back and joint problems. Regards, Ed Prohaska

You are going to be working your #$% off flying that much weight. Heavy models require to much physical energy to fly. At 61 years of age, I prefer smaller, lighter models. The ARF Nobler is great.


Linheart

Hi Linheart, I too was concerned it would be a "handful". But I flew it twice today and the pull was surprisingly mild. Final dry weight, after balancing, was 79 ounces and "wet" takeoff weight was well over 5 pounds! Weather conditions were perfect; temp in the low 80s and a light breeze that put the sun at my back.

The engine is an older Stalker .61 RE with a 13 X 5 Zinger prop, 6 oz. Brodak "Magnum vented" tank and Sig Synfuel (blended to 7% nitro). It could use a 6 or even 7 pitch prop. I didn't do much stunting, but enough to know that it has a "corner" with no "bobble", is very steady in level flight and has an excellent glide. Other engines can be used, including the old V-case ST .51, .56 and sixty. I ran it on the ground a few times with a ST .56 but got less than 6 minutes on the 6 oz. tank and wiped off enough Castor oil to fill a McDonald's French fryer! The Stalker can use fuel with less oil and little or no Castor and runs over 7 minutes on 5.5 ounces. I'll revisit the Super Tigers later, with an 8 oz. plastic tank.

There are a few "issues". The tip weight is rattling inside the box and needs to be packed with clay. It could use another 1/2 oz. to 1 oz. of nose weight and it needs a flap tweak (the outboard wing hangs low in level flight and high inverted). Nevertheless, at least for now, it does not feel anything like the 5 pound pachyderm that it is!

If I can trim this SCORE to fly the pattern in up to 15 mph wind, I'll have to revisit the 5 pound framed up Magnum that's been anchoring a corner of the basement for several years! Regards, Ed Prohaska

(snip)
>There are a few "issues". The tip weight is rattling
>inside the box and needs to be packed with clay. (snip)

Don't use clay. That adds more weight and will be hard to figure out what is too much or how to get less. Use cotton or just lightly wad a paper towel to "stuff" the weight box. That way you can remove the cotton or towel, add more (or remove some) weight, and stuff the same cotton or towel back in. Much simpler.

if you are using flat tip weight peices I use a peice of fuel tubing cut to length over the cover screw to hold the peices of weight ( for example brodak weights) from rattling, really simple if you use that kind of weights

My Score has a motor mount crutch in it too get a smoother engine run. I also added a rabe rudder on it and refinished it.

I have an ST .45 in my score weighs in at 72 ounces. The rabe rudder helps it up top on the hourglass, Vertical 8's and overheads.



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Don, Hi - Your SCORE looks better than mine! I did not know they came in different trim colors. Regards, Ed Prohaska

Ed,

Hi! Long time no C... Ran into Marty Schoenheiter at a VSC several years back...

If your AMA is current, or even if not, you can review the current AMA Rules at their website.

General, CL General, and of course, CLPA Rules are a good read for questions like you need answered.

the website is:

http://www.modelaircraft.org/

Hi Lou - Wow, it has been a long time! I now live in Plattsmouth, NE. Marty has been here 2 or 3 times. I sold him some ARFs and other stuff. He was doing some competitive speed flying; hope he gets into stunt. He offered to pay my way to VSC once, but I still could not afford the trip; maybe some day if I live long enough!

Yes, I'm still in the AMA. I have a 1980 rule book for reference! I've been doing some local contest flying the past few years. I don't recall anyone having to fly on anything thicker than .018" cable. Some very large .75 or .76 powered models may have opted for .021" lines, but the contest did not require it.

I have a .46 in my Skylark and use the required .018" lines. But I often used the heavier lines when I had a .40 in it. It's heavy (you may recall I usually built "heavy") and it drives hard in a wind.

I bet you are retired now and building/flying a lot. See you at VSC if I ever make it! Regards, Ed Prohaska