Stuka-in-the-box

Back at ( C )Old Germany it takes some time to adapt to about 40 degrees F again after having spent many great moments in the Arizona desert sun at Columbus Park in March. I’d like to thank all those people who’ve made me feel most welcome, helped to enter the contest and to get the motel room, and have made this trip possible at all ( Thanks, Keith ).
Transportation of a box including a little airplane is not as simple as it used to be. After having decided to make another visit to the VSC ( my third visit ) I tried to get as much information as possible, in order to overcome the problems which have been experienced by other flyers in recent years. For the benefit of other flyers who might plan airline travel with model boxes in the future, I want to explain my own experiences here.
In the past I’ve flown with Delta Airlines, which was a simple solution: the flight went via Atlanta, it started at Stuttgart airport, which is only one hour driving time from where I live. However after reading David Fitzgerald’s experience with Delta in Stunt News, I was somewhat doubtful. Indeed my travel agency told me that Delta doesn’t transport model boxes any more. So I decided on a LUFTHANSA flight from Frankfurt which is via Denver and goes to Tucson with UNITED.
Also I decided to remove engine and tank from the model and send it in a separate parcel to a private address in Tucson. There I would assemble the airplane and install engine and tank back again. In the recent past some people have put engine and tank into a plastic bag and put this into their suitcase. Some have succeeded in doing so. However I didn’t want to take a risk. It’s still considered “dangerous goods” ( engine and tank having contained inflammable fuel ), and what would happen if they would see this at the Xray check at check in ?!
My travel agency recommended to declare that I have a model box coming with me, and this was noted on the (digital) flight ticket. They informed me that this would cost me another 200 Euro - one way !!! payable at the airport. Okay, what can I do, and I considered VSC is worth the expenses.
When I arrived at the Frankfurt Lufthansa check in, they saw my ( long ) model box and directed me to the “oversize luggage” check in. Here they accepted my suitcase plus box WITHOUT any problem - without even asking or checking the contents of the box ! They even DIDN’T CHARGE me any money! One of the wonders of modern airline travel.
At Denver the break was scheduled for about 3 hours, but the US entry plus safety checks plus customs checks took most of this time, so it was an exciting experience leaving no moment of boredom. On arrival at Tucson the procedure was as easy and quick as you would wish.
After a wonderful VSC event ( again a BIG THANK YOU to the organizer ) my little STUKA was disassembled right at the flying field, stored into the box at the motel room, and the engine and tank was given to Keith who would send it back to Germany.
Expecting a complicated procedure on Sunday morning I was at Tucson airport very early. At the UNITED check in I was asked to present suitcase AND box simultaneously. A ( somewhat smallish ) lady remarked that my model box was oversize. I told her that it had been accepted as being within the limits at Frankfurt ( the limit is length plus width plus height = 100 inch = 254 centimeters ), and that I didn’t have to pay for oversize luggage there. The ( somewhat smallish ) lady stood up as tall as she was able to be, and said: “ I’m 5 feet tall, and this box is taller than I am, so it’s oversize”.
Well, I didn’t want to argue, and I wanted to get through this hassle as quick as possible, so I accepted her demands. However - during all the check in process, I never had to pay any money, I never had to sign any paper, I never was asked for my credit card, and I never noticed that anybody would try to get one single Cent from me. Very strange.
Maybe in several months I will find out that somebody has charged my bank account for some unknown amount of money ??!!!
The return flight was an extremely easy affair. Nothing at all to do at Denver. On arrival at Frankfurt, I went through passport control very quickly, picked up my suitcase and my model box, and went through customs control effortless - there even wasn’t a person watching or controlling people ! ( imagine - I could have had engine and tank installed in the model - or a bomb transported in my model box !!! ). So it looks that all my efforts ( sending engine and tank separately ) were in vain and that I could have easily sent everything ( including fuel !!! ) without any problems in the model box.
My model box measures 168 X 37 X 26 Centimeters = 231 cm overall length = 90,9 inch, which is well below the permitted 100 inches - however long a little lady may stretch her body. It was built for a bigger ( 60 size ) airplane some years ago; so there was a lot of space left for transporting any kind of additional goods that I might have desired to carry along with me - and that didn’t go into the overloaded suitcase.
Result: transport of a model via airline is still a big mystery. It doesn’t seem to depend on strict and clear rules or laws of airlines. Not one of all the people related to airline travel/ luggage transport was competent enough to give correct advice. All seems to boil down on intellectual abilities of airport stuff, their particular mood on any given day, and whether they had eggs for breakfast or not. I’m sorry that I cannot give you any bulletproof advice. In my case, I didn’t want to take a risk and being dependent on the quality of somebody else’s grey cells whether my model box would go or not.
So much the better I appreciate the support I got from helpful friends at Tucson. As long as MY grey cells keep working, I’ll never forget American generousity and assistance I got at Tucson, hearty welcome at Columbus Park, and friendship I received at Circulo Zagala.

Claus maikis



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Claus,

It was nice to see you at VSC and thank you for sharing the experience regarding to the travel with a plane. Your advise on shipping engine and tank make great sense. How about the supporting items (line, handle, syringe, glow driver..)? I am planning to travel oversea later this year with my take-apart Vector so I am curious to know how you deal with those items.

Regards,

Sean

Claus,
I don't think all your efforts were in vain. The suitcases should have been x-rayed or checked in some other fashion for bombs. Taking out the engine and shipping separate was smart, in my eyes.

However, the box size is an issue, and you are at the total discretion of the counter person (just ask Dave). However, if you keep the box to within the 62 inch limit, there are NO questions. At the same time Dave couldn't get on, both Orestes and I didn't even get asked what was in our boxes!

If you were to travel again, I would suggest having the wing separate from the fuse, and the box could be so much smaller, and there should be no problems, from anyone.

I'm glad you had a good time.

Interesting stuff.

If I ever use airlines to attend another contest I will seriously consider shipping the models via UPS, DHL, FedEx, Railway Express, maybe even USPS to avoid the high price and unpredictible policies of the airlines.

ps: Upon return from an offshore vacation, the big X-ray machine spotted an apple buried inside a huge duffle bag. The apple was disposed of and I was warned about my attmept to smuggle in farm produce.
Moral of the story: Don't think you can sneak anything by, no matter how deep it's buried.

I am betting that the current drop in airline customers has also played a role. Back last year when every seat was filled and they were still turning people away the airlines would tend to play hardball about luggage.

Does anybody know if explosives detection equipment will be alarmed by nitrate dope in airplane finishes or by traces of nitromethane left on airplanes?

Howard Rush
Bellevue, WA

Only for you, Howard.


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Some days it seems like a coin toss between George Orwell and Monty Python...

That's exactly what I suspected.

Howard Rush
Bellevue, WA

>Does anybody know if explosives detection equipment will be
>alarmed by nitrate dope in airplane finishes or by traces of
>nitromethane left on airplanes?
>
>Howard Rush
>Bellevue, WA

Howard,
The explosives sensing equipment would indeed pick up the nitrates in Nitrate Dope if it was "wet" or extrememly hot and outgassing.
I work with "energetics" and I actually had the heels ripped off my shoes by an over-zelous "sniffer operator" on one trip after visiting a powder facility. Apparently there was enough on my shoes to alert the sniffer.
Either that or the guy just didn't like the looks of me!

Randy C

HI Howard. I had that experience flying from Huntsville, Alabama to Denver after having attended VSC 18 two months earlier.. Seems a few drops of fuel got spilled out of a tank onto my overnight bag. I figured after a few months it would dissapate. WRONGO. The tiny hand held sniffer with the tiny piece of paper set off a heck of an alarm. I was TOLD to step aside and open my bag. Up comes a young guy, slim, moustache and all, very officious, with a clip board with 99 forms on it. Oh, crap, Mary is having to go without me, I can feel it now.
I don't know why I did it, but along with my drivers licence and retired military ID, I showed him my AMA license too. Thank you God, he flies RC and knew instantly what I was talking about. Took three minutes and I was back in line. Whew. But those things are very sensitive. Good thing they never sniffed my shoes, I'd still be up against the wall. [photo not recovered: sipcof.gif]

Ty

The sensors are very sensitive and the residues persistent.

I was working for the Oz Navy in mid-2002 when a member of the project team went to the US for a couple of weeks. He had to use a soft bag that had carried explosives once, several years before.

The bag was dry cleaned several times after the explosives, once just before he left Australia, but the residue was still detected.

Cheers, Geoff

Hi Claus

I travel a lot (unfortunately!) I am also involved in cargo security work-wise. As others have said, your baggage goes through all sorts of checks that you do not know about and never see, before it gets on the plane. As others have said - BEWARE OF NITRATES. The most minute amounts will set off the detectors.

Incidentally, who has noticed those "AIR CONDITIONERS" alongside the lines of passengers waited for security check? Did you notice that they SUCK, and don't blow?

Last, the airlines seem totally random as regards large or overweight baggage. In the First World its not usually a problem, but you get hit hard on the return flight from 3rd World and Easr European flights. Part of their revenue, I guess?

Charles

Claus-

I am very happy that your stay and travels were relatively hassle free. You did take the right precautions.

One thing I would add though, and this concerns Delta and American (AA) Airlines. We quite recently flew from Cleveland to Ft. Lauderdale, Florida via Atlanta for a Carribbean vacation and then back from Miami to Cleveland via Chicago's OHare (ORD) , and these travels were NOT pleasant. The "homeland Security" folks were OK (our one pleasant surprise after hearing friends' experiences) but the airlines again were not. To somewhat shorten an otherwise long and annoying story, these are the other issues one must look out for:

1) American "overbooks" flights, and in our case, even though reservations - and payment - were made months in advance, we arrived to find that we had no seats. We would not have been able to fly on our own flights, had I not informed the entire world of my dissatisfaction and the representative paid someone $275.00 and doubled their miles to entice them to trade flights so that we could sit in the back in separate areas. This happened on both return flights.

2) Airlines now often(?) change gates while you are in the air. Thus you may arrive without time to walk a mile or more in the big terminals to make your connections.

3) American Airlines now charges extra for baggage over the first simple case, which has resulted in some pretty large carry-on luggage appearing in the overhead racks. Your airfair on this airline may exceed your expectations.

Such common and apparently acceptable deceits and ethical violations can easily separate you from your luggage, which for us was almost lost for the week at Ft. Lauderdale.

So, keep a close eye on that model!

SK

Claus, it was great seeing you again. I will probably never make it to Germany or any other european country. I don't think I would ever try to transport any models and admire those that do.

I have been out of country three times in my life and have not had any problems with airlines or the people. The one question was when the wife and I came back from Hawaii. The xray showed the metal can the wifes new sunglasses were in. Of course it happened to be in my bag and I didn't remember them. I readily opened the bag for them. Even tho I would have stayed in Hawaii if they had told me to.

Anyway glad you had a good trip and hope to see you again.
DOC Holliday

Claus,
It was very nice seeing you again and sincerest hopes for a return visit.

Randy C.

I fly within the 48 States pretty much every week or so, and can confirm that the current situation for overbooking and " excessive baggage" is bad and getting worse. I would say ship via a freight carrier if possible and not to expensive- the airline does not care that you have a years worth of work and sweat in a box in the hold.

I check my suitcase every time ( and often pay a fee for even 1 bag) becuase I travel with a small toolbox of speciality tools for my equipment. The bag I check is considered a " roll- aboard size", that would fit in the overhead bin of most planes larger than a regional jet. I carry a laptop backpack and a sweatshirt onto the plane.
I see scores of people dragging " carry-on" larger than what I check, ignoring the request to put them in wheels first, and place your 2nd bag under the seat. They stop at the 1st open spot in a bin they see and start stuffing their load in- even if their seat is 15 rows further back. Agravating to say the least!

Airline employees are overworked,tired, fed-up, and just want to get the door closed and get in the air. They don't want to confront passengers and get into a pissing contest with a person who thinks the $159 they paid through an on-line discount ticket agency gives them part ownership in the company, and the rules are for other people. I just sit back, put my headphones on, close my eyes and pretend I am asleep. My consolation is that my ticket is paid for by the company, and I am on the clock. Enjoy your flight!

Bill Heher
If it's broke, fix it.
If it aint broke - let me see it for a minute

>They don't want to confront passengers and get into a pissing contest with a person who thinks the $159 they paid through an on-line discount ticket agency
> gives them part ownership in the company, and the rules are for other people.

???

While my ticket was not bought via on-line discount, it apparently did not entitle me to what I paid for, even though they were "earning" interest on my money. I thought that it entitled me to what it represented - passage on my flight, with reasonable efforts at on-time arrival. According to AA, it did not, because, and I quote, "Everybody's doing it" (overbooking). In my case, even though I contacted AA at ORD (from the gate at MIA) to straighten things out 5 1/2 hours before arrival and showed up at that ORD departure gate to get my ticket 1 1/2 hours before departure, they had already given all available tickets to people flying stand-by. I am still not amused.

SK

You just never know...

Long before 9/11 -- sometime in the early '90s in fact -- I was enroute back to Kuwait from home leave. Awaiting my carry-on bag at a London/Heathrow security point I was suddenly "bookended" by two uniformed, submachine gun-bearing gentlemen who politely insisted I step to the side and "open that".

Apparently a McCoy .19 resembles a grenade on the X-ray machine.

At any rate: Claus, thank you for being at the VSC again. Your Stuka is ausgeseichnet!

Mike Keville
Tucson, AZ
AMA 14220

One note on a few airline employees, especially little women. My younger sister #2, the total freaking twit, used to work for Eastern, then Continental and PAA. All three are gone, plus she has gone through three husbands. Hmmm??? I am glad I never had to deal with her at any airline desk. She is the type that makes big declarations that have NOTHING to do with rules, excepte hers. Surprised she hasn't been shot my now. She may have trained the short lady Claus met. Hey, it could happen

Claus
You and your plane were a delight to all of us at VSC. Having built two Stuka Stunts I have a bias here, but I really enjoyed watching you fly. I was amazed to watch you take it apart on the last day of flying. Glad you and the plane made it back in good shape and look forward to seeing you again at a future VSC or better yet in Germany on a vacation.
Andy Borgogna

G'day folks

While not strictly relevant to Claus' post, I had some fun getting Brodak ARC Vectors to Australia late last year.

You may be aware of the problems getting large packages out of the US via USPS so I organised a neice who lives in Dallas to bring two back as accompanied baggage when she and her partner returned to Oz for Christmas.

Two kits, packed together measured 13" x 14" x about 53" and weighed 20 pounds.

Korean Air carried the package without penalty but the weight was included in their total weight allowance.

A relevant point however, is that while doing my research, snow board/ski cases kept turning up. It seems that the airlines will carry these without complaint. You still need to remove the wing and at least the fin but so long as the snowboard case is within its standard length, it seems that there should not be a problem.

Worth thinking about if you are going to move models around by air very often.

Cheers, Geoff

All,

My son and I have traveled to Europe the last two summers (2007, 2008) to fly F2C (team Race). We have not had any problems with the airlines, TSA (or the national equivalent in the European countries), or customs.

First, we do not carry models, engine parts, or model airplane equipment onto the airplane.

Second, our airplane carrier is a gutted Samsonite hard side suitcase. Of course, F2C models are smaller that your average stunter, even if it disassembles. The airplane case has nothing but models in it. No engines, tanks, or tools. Most baggage handlers think the suitcase is empty. With 3 models weighing less that 150 grams each, it just as well be empty.

Third, we have a separate bag for our equipment. Our flying clothes go into this bag. The clothes always smell like we just walked in from working on a diesel vehicle even when they are clean.

There are NO markings on the outside of either bag that says anything about the contents being fragile, model airplanes, AMA, or FAI.

We request a letter from the AMA for the period we are going to be out of the country that explains we are participating in international model airplane competition. Then we attach a tailored letter for the specific day of the flight which explains that the items in the bag are harmless. That the contents have been exposed to methanol or kerosene based products and that some residue may be detectable. A signed copy of the letters are placed in each bag on top of everything in the bag.

At the Lufthansa counter in Germany they have a sign with a picture of a model airplane engine (looks like an OS 40). The sign says engines are prohibited. So we followed the advice of the French F2C Team Manager. We do not carry engines. We carry engine parts and the containers in the equipment bag are labeled as parts. We disassemble the engines and put the parts in small containers, then into zip-lock bags, and all the parts for two engines being placed in a larger tupperware type container. We flush the tanks with castor oil and then wash them with hot soapy water. The remaining equipment is washed with hot soapy water, dried, placed in zip-lock bags, and placed in a larger sealed container.

We follow the same procedure (without the AMA letter) when flying in the states.

We have been using this approach since 1999 and have not had a problem. Or most recent model airplane trip was in Feb 2009. The single biggest key seems to be, do not draw attention to your equipment.

Dave

I wonder why they don't like engines? They are hardly "lethal weapons"

There was a 9-foot B-36 at the Toledo Show. It was to be powered with six electric motors which (along with the batteries) had not yet been purchased.

The builder was unable to get it on an airliner out of Winnipeg AT ALL. The inspectors were so DUG IN to the idea the all model airplanes have gas engines, there was no chance of discussion.

They ended up travelling to Toledo by surface vehicle (as The Lord intended).

The B-36 was built entirely of sheet metal, thus enclosing a significant volume which could not be X-rayed. Perhaps that was the issue.

As an aside, the builder estimated the his cost for motors, controllers, batteries, and synchronizers would be upwards of 6,000C$, which is not yet in hand. Any contributors?

>I wonder why they don't like engines? They are hardly
>"lethal weapons"

Because there is an FAR that specifically mentioned engines that have ever had fuel in them. Somewhere else there is an FAR that says it's OK to use a "passivating agent" to clean the engine to make it OK, but that's buried somewhere. David and Chris Cox dug that one out.

But the bottom line is that once you get to the airport, you are completely at the mercy of whichever little Hitler you happen to run across, legal or not.

Brett

And they wonder why the airlines are hemorrhaging money and going out of business left and right. Geez. Maybe I'll just drive to VSC next year.


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Some days it seems like a coin toss between George Orwell and Monty Python...