Top Flight LusterKote paint

Thought the bad should be in here with the good.

DO NOT buy this stuff it is crap, if you heat the can you may be able to get it to squirt in smaller blobs but then you have to worry about your finish turning black when exposed to the sun. Use Rustoleum instead.

>Thought the bad should be in here with the good.
>
>DO NOT buy this stuff it is crap, if you heat the can you
>may be able to get it to squirt in smaller blobs but then
>you have to worry about your finish turning black when
>exposed to the sun. Use Rustoleum instead.

Since I'm the one who has spent some time extolling the virtues of LusterKote, I thought I would jump in here as well.

Bob and others have posted about problems with the paint, specifically darkening over time until it's blotchy with a very dark or black tint. It appears that this darkening goes completely through the coating, and can't be sanded off without removing the layer completey. One should certainly be aware that this has happened to some people and that it seems to be more prevalent with certain colors, namely Red.

Though others have had this problem, and I do believe they have, I would suggest that those considering using LusterKote paints do so with forewarning.

I personally have not experienced the problem on my planes, but, I'm watching them carefully. Mostly I use white and have planes several years old without a problem. My most recent plane does indeed have some red on it. I hope that I don't have a problem with it.

I remember when Top Flight first came out with the coatings, they had some formulation problems and withdrew it from the market for a time. I don't know if any of these problems are due to old stock, or they still have problems.

I still intend to use it, but, I use it on planes that aren't necessarily top end stunters. For them I use a different system. I have always liked L.K. in the past as it goes on quick, drys fast, and is very fuel proof.

I would suppose the best thing to say is, there are advantages, and problems to consider when using the product. Be wise and choose what is best for your application.

Be sure that if I see any darkening on my planes, I will also post it here.

What prompted the origional post was another try at using LusterKote on a sport plane I am re-finishing. The last Stunt plane I used it on turned black and crinkled. I had two cans of Red and thought rather than throw them out I would use them to paint a plane that won't normally be left in the sun for extended periods. Now I wish I had just pitched them..

The first can I tried sprayed only big globs even after heating and shaking forever, I went ahead and sprayed the plane (in 3 steps) then sanded the blobs flat after it dried. I sanded through the red in a couple of places so thought I would use the second can to do a little touch up. It not only sprayed big blobs it also sprayed little black chunks.

I have read all the hints and know how to spray paint, this wasn't me it was the crapy paint and I hope I can save someone else from not only throwing away money but adding allot of work trying to get an acceptable finish. Now I have a big problem, I refuse to buy more LusterKote and have a half finished airplane with black specks.. Never again....

>What prompted the origional post was another try at using
>LusterKote on a sport plane I am re-finishing. The last
>Stunt plane I used it on turned black and crinkled. I had
>two cans of Red and thought rather than throw them out I
>would use them to paint a plane that won't normally be left
>in the sun for extended periods. Now I wish I had just
>pitched them..
>
>The first can I tried sprayed only big globs even after
>heating and shaking forever, I went ahead and sprayed the
>plane (in 3 steps) then sanded the blobs flat after it
>dried. I sanded through the red in a couple of places so
>thought I would use the second can to do a little touch up.
>It not only sprayed big blobs it also sprayed little black
>chunks.
>
>I have read all the hints and know how to spray paint, this
>wasn't me it was the crapy paint and I hope I can save
>someone else from not only throwing away money but adding
>allot of work trying to get an acceptable finish. Now I have
>a big problem, I refuse to buy more LusterKote and have a
>half finished airplane with black specks.. Never again....

Bob,
It happens with the blue too!!! Big blobs of blue!!!
After 10 minutes under a heat gun and another 5 shaking until my arm fell off.

$8.00 right out the window!!!
Did you get yours at Wings and Things?

I'll never use anything but Rustoleum from now on.

LusterKote SUCKS

regards,
Rick "catdaddy" Blankenship

I think one can did come from Wings n Things but the other came from the hobby shop on the east side (not Russ) and was fairly new stock.

I did a test and discovered that dope will go over it without problems so maybe I can save this mess with some clear dope. Didn't paint the cowel yet so it will get rustoleum.

Bob,
I had just bought some Lustercoat for the first time but won't us it now after reading about your nightmare experience. I've now got some Rustoleum. Before spraying Rustoleum, what do you use to (1) seal the bare balsa and (2) act as a primer over monocote. Thanks for any help.
DennisV

My fast and dirty sport finishing system,

Coat all bare wood with finishing resin (Z-Poxy or SIG). I mix the finishing resin 50/50 with denatured alcohol and brush it on. After all the wood is covered and before it cures wipe as much as you can off with paper towels. This seals the wood and doesn't add a significant amount of weight. After the finishing resin is cured (overnight) sand with 320 just enough to knock the fuzz off. If you don't care about the grain being filled you can skip the filler and it is ready to paint.

To fill the grain I mix Corn Starch with Brodak clear thinned 50/50. Brush on a couple of coats with light sanding between coats. Sand the final coat almost all off and brush on one coat of 50/50 clear to seal the filler. Brodak clear dries well enough to sand in a couple of hours so the entire filling step can be done in one day. The next day sand the final coat of clear with 400 just enough to smooth the surface and it is ready to mask and paint.

To paint over Monokote, clean the area with acetone, lightly scuff with 400 sandpaper or fine steel wool clean it again and it is ready to paint...

It is really a shame that Lusterkote is such crap as the idea is great. It dries fast, sands well and is really fuel proof. Rustoleum sprays on great but takes a couple of days to really dry and I don't think the finish is quite as tough as Lusterkote.

Bob,
Thanks for sharing your finishing method. I appreciate the help. Now to get painting on that Flite Streak!
DennisV

I am very suspicious as to supposed problems with LustreKote. Before bailing on this stuff I would have to know a lot more than I do at this time about substrate and the many other factors.

My first Impact has LustreKote red on the wheel pants and a couple other (small) parts. No problems at all, although I will admit the pants don't see much direct exposure to sunlight. Several other models have LustreKote on them, again small parts such as the wheel hubs on my Zilch X, for example.

Don McClave has created a whole series of 17-18 point Classic models (local judging, not the Nationals) using MonoKote on the flying surfaces, LustreKote on the fuselage. Never a problem of any kind; at least none of which I am aware and I am sure I would know if this were to be the case.

For what it's worth I personally have not seen any negative results from the use of LustreKote; this and the fact it matches MonoKote so well means that of course I will continue to use this product.

Danny Dirt

Do a search on any of the RC forums and you will see this isn't a figment of our imaginations. The black chunks coming out of a can of RED paint have nothing to do with the substrate or the painters ability to squirt. Maybe there are some good cans out there but would you take the chance?

Bob,

Thanks for confirming this issue is not a figmentation of your imagination. Of course, I did not claim that it might be.

In my view, yours is anecdotal evidence. As is mine. Having never personally seen a problem with this paint, of course I will be using it on my new Impact.

Right after the first pfffft goes on a scrap piece of material.

Danny Dirt

My two cents worth. Using Lustercote over dope carries significant risk if the dope is not allowed to totally gas off. Enamel and Lacquer really are not compatable and that is exactly what you are doing. Dope should be allowed to gas off for at least a week.
I have 6/7 planes done with Lustercote including the infamous red color, some at least 3 years old and so far no problem. One thing that I have always done is use the Lustercote primer. It's not really a filling primer and is tough to sand but it is an effective barrier against anything that might be incompatable, and gives good bite for the paint. I have found that the cans do not empty uniformly and you have to keep reheating the can as it empties of you can really get a case of spit from the nozzle.
What I am noticing is that the new stuff is not as glossy as the older product that I had, requiring some buffing of the clear and polishing it. Enamel is really tough to polish don't you know? Dennis

I've had many years of painting experience; in fact, made a living for 10 years doing custom painting (musical instruments, race cars and custom motorcycles) and I also ran a furniture finishing spray shop with 10 people under me.
With that said, I have always finished my models with dope; a couple years ago a friend of mine built a Brodak's Oriental using Monokote on the wings and LustreKote on everything else and it really came out nice. I painted 50 or so canopy/rudder for Ukeyman with the light blue and they all came out perfect and in half the time of using dope. Now last year I built a Brodak Fancy Pants for my Saito 30, I silk covered the wings and did all the prep work with Sig Nitrate Clear; after lots of drying time and final sanding I thought I would use LustreKote. I bought a can of primer and 3 cans of light purple, painted the landing gear covers (great), I gave the airplane a coat of primer and started with light coats of purple (per instructions on the can), one can was great, the second can started to spit so I used the third can for the final coat (a total of 3 coats). It looked pretty good, I came back 30 minutes later and there were tiny little air bubbles on one wing tip, some on the nose and along the trailing edge of the elevator; I let the airplane dry for a week then I wet sanded out the air bubbles and resprayed. Considering I did everything by the book and one can was totally useless (even tried a spray nozzle from another can) plus all the extra sanding I doubt if I'll ever use this stuff again except on small parts

I learned on my Nobler to hold the can inverted, spray the entire contents into a glass jar, place in a spray gun and apply with an air compressor. Some cans won't spray at all. I'm very pleased with the paint, just not the delivery system.

In my previous post I had said that I used it and had no real insurmountable problems. This was true till today. I had 3 new cans of Insignia Blue for a project. One sprayed for 1 minute and the others didn't work at all.
In desperation I tried an old trick that had worked before.
Put rubber gloves on and removed the nozzle and used a dull tipped instrument to depress the ball check valve. On all three cans they discharged coagulated paint.
I reapplied the tips and they sprayed well enough to finish the project.
I've notified the company about this and I'll be curious to see what develops.
I'm not dissatisfied with the paint as it worked well, I'm not however apologising for the product. Top Flite has a problem with paint thickening in the delivery tube or at the bottom, simply a guess on my part.
Point is I guess I'll be using something else.

If these were new cans, that is bad news. There shouldn't be any paint at the ball check valve at all.

A good trick to use after spraying with any spray can paint is to turn the can upside down and give a couple of short bursts so there is just air flowing through the tube. That way the check valve, etc., doesn't get clogged up while waiting for the next time you use it.

Oh, and store regular paint cans upside down. This keeps air from seeping in and keeps the paint from getting the "scummies" on top (or dryhing out altogether.)

Just an update on what I found when I re-finished the bad LusterKote paint on the Omnium.

I started sanding off the blackened cracked Lusterkote and found the previous coats under the top coat were still good. I originally painted the plane all white then put two good coats of red on the fuselage top. Putting two coats of red was not by design, I had allot of trouble getting a smooth finish so ended up painting it twice.

This told me the substrate was not the problem, it was the last can of red that turned to crap due to some reaction with the Sun. If you use this stuff you may not have the problem but not worth taking another chance on for this boy....

Bob, You may recall that I too had the black problem with Luster coat blue from our chats in the winter. Well I tried to scrape off the top and sand it as well and the black goes all the way through. Origanily the plane was under coated with nitrate, Sig I believe, it was left to gas off for 2 years! Then I added some Sig Clear left it sit several months and finally finished it off with Luster Coat blue in 1997. It started to turn in 2000 and has now leveled of at a basic ugly black tarnished look! The plane is a mule and I really don't care but it will be a loooong time before I use this product again!

>Thought the bad should be in here with the good.
>
>DO NOT buy this stuff it is crap, if you heat the can you may
>be able to get it to squirt in smaller blobs but then you have
>to worry about your finish turning black when exposed to the
>sun. Use Rustoleum instead.
>
first of all.....the paint is the best. 2nd of all.....you must be smart enough to understand how to use it. why would you heat the can anyway? you just go to walmart then buy your paint there. then leave your silly comments at home if your that dumb about paint!!

>>Thought the bad should be in here with the good.
>>
>>DO NOT buy this stuff it is crap, if you heat the can you
>may
>>be able to get it to squirt in smaller blobs but then you
>have
>>to worry about your finish turning black when exposed to
>the
>>sun. Use Rustoleum instead.
>>
>first of all.....the paint is the best. 2nd of all.....you
>must be smart enough to understand how to use it. why would
>you heat the can anyway? you just go to walmart then buy your
>paint there. then leave your silly comments at home if your
>that dumb about paint!!


Really? I don't think that was a necessary comment - we all have had varying levels of issues with the Luster-Kote products and most of us are daff hands at applying finish coats of paint. Doubt if any modelers buy their finish coat products from a Wal-Mart sir.
Joe

Leonard Please check this persons profile. We don't need these uncalled for comments. Thanks............. edit because this is in response to #18.

Lustrekote has worked for me. I used old Areo-gloss/ areo-dyne paints and then the Top Coat. Planes looks good and product was user friendly.
Dan

I used Lustercoat clear over my Twister painted with SIG paints and it turned like I have brown spots on the plane.Will never use the stuff again. I used Rustoleum white over a dope base after I let the dope gas off and It came out fine,of course I waited for a month for the stuff to stop being tacky.I have used 15% nitro fuel with no adverse effect.
Juan

I've used several cans of white, red, yellow and insignia blue. The white cracked after a year the rest were so thin on pigment as to be useless. The only one that was any good was a can of sky blue and it came from a hobbyshop and was quite old. The rest came from Tower. They would be good for transparent finishes. I still have the cans for evidence.

>Thought the bad should be in here with the good.
>
>DO NOT buy this stuff it is crap, if you heat the can you may
>be able to get it to squirt in smaller blobs but then you have
>to worry about your finish turning black when exposed to the
>sun. Use Rustoleum instead.
>

Hmmmm...
Certainly not doubting the veracity of this post...but I have used Lustrecoat paint on at least 5 airplanes successfully.
The blobbing problem is definitly a real possibility and I mentioned it in a thread on this forum. I also mentioned the fix was to simply spray only at temps over 70 degrees and shake the can, and shake the can, and shake the can, and keep shaking the can.
There are potential problems in applying nearly any paint products but this stuff once applied is the most fuel proof paint I've ever come across. I actually put a piece of balsa covered with fiberglass cloth and painted with red lustre coat (two coats) and left it in 15% Nitro fuel for two days and it did not soften or change color.
I spray and paint in a very dry and warm environment in Arizona and it's possible this could be some of the difference but other than the potential to blob that I mentioned I have never had any other problem.
I would add that it's possible to make an objective report on a product without calling it names.


Randy Cuberly

For those of you who have used Rustoleum instead,... how closely does the Rustoleum colors match MonoKote colors??

Thanks!!

Steve T.